Well, suffice to say some of us interact more than others. Assumption is not in play here. The very same Malaysian Chinese fans still cheers Fuzzy and HH (with all his yoyo-ing way). Back where the Sidek brothers (Misbun, Rashid, Razif, Jalani) were playing against chinese players you could see the same things. Your argument also hold no ground against the INA players and the Indonesian Chinese, where the current top aces for most category (MS, WS, XD and half of MD and WD) are non-Chinese.
First, I don't know who's whom on this forum. 2nd, there are also many best ever badminton talents from Indonesia are ethnic Chinese, such as Rudy Hartono, Liem Swie King, Susi Susanti, Mia Audina, Alan Budikusuma, Arbi..., even Permadi, Tony, Candra, Flandy,... are all ethnic Chinese. Because of its cruel conditions and denial of status for generations, Chinese there had to convert to survive. Most of them cannot speak Chinese, and their body physically are Chinese, but their minds, their culture are not any more. In fact, we really have no idea about those Indonesia players' ethnicity. Any argument is only valid within its domain which includes conditions and limitations. Even Newtonian theory are wrong for both high speed and microscopic world
Looks like.. ..the 2nd round of this debate has ensued... ..yet, the members who originally lit up this debate (akhem, Jagdpanther and kuwichert) haven't been seen in this thread since... ..i recall another INA member, Rahayu (here's the catch, i don't think she's INA-Chinese), who is a big time supporter of Wang Chen..and a lot of non-INA players.. ..on the other side of the spectrum, i know there are quite a few INA-Chinese BCers who support non-INA-Chinese players.. ..race>nationality? nationality>race?..IMO, in the end, the majority of die hard INA badminton supporters in BC (whether they're INA-Chinese or non-INA-chinese) would support their players and could care less if the players are of Chinese ancestry or not. Of course, there will be a few INA BCers who will cheer exclusively for CHN or non-INA players, but i feel they're in the minority. ..oh well, i guess this will continue on and who knows where this will end up..
I agree with ctjcad.. and it's up to them. "ANYONE CAN SUPPORT ANYPLAYERS...and MOST OF BC'ers DONT CARE, AS LONG AS THEY DONT MOCK OR INSULT OTHERS"... I THINK IT'S CLEAR... peace...
Ok, chris is right, I do get confused with your argument. Are you questioning whether the likes of Taufik, Sony, Nova Butet,etc are really chinese ? Yes, there're tons of top Indonesian Chinese shuttlers, but there're also plenty of top non chinese shuttler. Ricky/Rexy, Icuk, Joko, to name a few. They too (like Taufik,etc nowadays) were supported by the Indonesian Chinese. Or are you saying the chinese indonesian that support the non-chinese indonesian players are chinese in name only, (since they can't speak chinese,etc)...and therefore can't be considered chinese? If that's the case, it might be true for some (hence the totok vs babah argument), by my experience has been many of the very same folks you accused of not being chinese = still speak mandarin, practice chinese belief and consider them chinese. Lets look at the Malaysian. In general, the malaysian chinese are in much better shape compared to the indonesian chinese. They're the biggest minority group and wield considerable influence in both politics and economy and generally are more accepted than that of their indonesian chinese counterpart. Most of them still practices chinese culture and don't differ much from those of mainland chinese. Yet, take a look at Thomas Cup 1990 finals and see whom they're cheering.
Yup, another living example against 2cents statement, albeit from a different angle. AGREED 100%. That's why I think the race >><<<>>><<>< nationality thingy is foolish to begin with. People will cheers whoever they wish to cheers for....yellow, brown, black skinned be damned.
LOL, I have to admit, but everyone with common sense knows, that my point is only valid on statisical meanning. It proves nothing, if you cite your cousin as a living example. That's the fundamental difference between you and me, that's the fundamental difference between religion and science. Religion is always right for religious people, because it's a doctrine without reasoning. You have your doctrine and cannot find the relationships between facts, cannot find the patterns between information. Everything for you is either predesigned or unknown forever, so you cannot see any thing, regardless race, nationality. Therefore, there is no wonder for you foolishly view any logical activity as foolish. My view is scientific, and what I was trying to do is to dig out the relationship and pattern hidden in this process. My search result is the finding of this race nationality precedence. It’s absolutely okay for anyone challenge my results, but if you disagree from the religious standpoint, it helps nothing. Fans, spectators support or cheer for someone other than the others. There must be some reasons. That’s the starting point of reasoning. If you are totally blinded here, and insisting the world is unknown, then please stop here, you cannot understand any further beyond this point. The reasons, in my opinion should be any combination of three in the following order: 1: Self identification and redemption of self esteem 2: Economical advantages 3: Affection There is no no-brainer support someone without any reason. Race and ethnicity, other than nationality, are the cheapest way for people recognize themselves through their idol. People tend to have delusions about their idol, tend to imagine the success of their own. If you deny all what I said, there is no surprise at all, because they are sub-conscious, which you cannot control. You even don’t know where and how your adrenal gland drives you to.
I hate to be involved in this debate. But the highlighted words perfectly sum up my feeling. Who cares about whether our INA players are Chinese or non-Chinese....as long as they carry our flag, most of us are supporting them. Which is why we feel that fans like Ajaib and tommy_bun are exceptions since they are willing to support players from other countries above their nations But hey, they are free to support whoever they like In the current INA team, we can see many players who are not of Chinese ancestry but have done very well for INA to win the World Championships and All-England: 1. Markis Kido 2. Nova Widianto 3. Liliyana Natsir (half Chinese blood I believe) 4. Rexy Mainaky 5. Ricky Subagja 6. Icuk Sugiarto 7. Joko Suprianto and the list continues.... I will think that it's totally absurd for INA fans (not fans living in INA but supporting other nations) of Chinese-descent who will support only players of Chinese-descent Which is why the reactions towards 2cents comments are very strong
The END ok.. here is my final words here First i wanna say thanks to support from everyone here... for : 2cents ( i agree with all your comment here, just becoz i had bad english,,, so i cannot say much here)), lcleing, my teammates Suetyan, tommy_bun, volcom, and others that i can't say it one by one,,, i really appreciate with your care about my Right to had my personal choice,,, again,,,,, this is good for me as long as i don't insult another players or another country,,, and FOR SURE : Me, AJAIB never insult other players or country .... i just support my team,, and if that HURTS someone here so badly,,,, well i just can say SORRY DORRY BORRY but that's my RIGHT.....so,,, technically it must be no problem here.... whatever people here try to push me for not support China,, i will say: NO i will support CHINA and i'm proud of that... i decided not to post on this thread for few days just to avoid harsh debate from me,, i'm worried if i cannot control my self,,, so i decided to keep silent...( and of course i must study english coz i had bad english),,,, and i think that it should be end here.... Thanks a lot and PLEASE LEARN TO RESPECT ANOTHER MEMBERS CHOICE TO SUPPORT WHOEVER HE/SHE WANT.
whewwww... better stop it dude...... it has been discuss by others and i just try to made the thread... u should read the reason why ADMIN closed that thread,,, and please dont drag this thread to other hot debate anymore.... and if u think that topics is not fact,,, u should search and look for the statistic... INDEED LCW is the first WR no.1 has record to lost from lowest rank players ever.... that's fact and not insult.....
To add to the above post: "even if China playing their lowest rank player in their current team,, they can beat malaysia" "i know the answer : becoz he is anti China fans.... so if you don't want to be corious again... just did like what i did : I put Limsy on list of anti china Fans.. so if he never talk good about China player's then i understand what is the reason...." huahhhh.........
