NEW: Fixed Height Experiment for Service

Discussion in 'Rules / Tournament Regulation / Officiating' started by CantSmashThis, Jan 10, 2013.

  1. event

    event Regular Member

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    I think if you look at this video, it suggests that Axelsen's lowest rib is about 6" above the 1.15m line. I figure the matching rib-owner is somewhere between 5'8" and 5'10".
     
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  2. xiaoqiao

    xiaoqiao Regular Member

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    That vid is very misleading. He pulled his pants very very high to prove his point.
     
  3. event

    event Regular Member

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    I'm not so sure they ever were faulted because I never once saw one even attempted by a pro. But even flicks were faulted, so often based on erroneous judgments that the shafts were pointing upward. I know that many on this forum have, as Cheung pointed out, said it was impossible to drive a serve legally under the old rules, something with which I and others disagree. I also know that drive serves in club play often elicit accusations of faults, in the absence of any reference to rules in many cases. I would say that top players just assumed, correctly, that BWF umpires would fault any attempt at a drive serve. Another reason we never saw them, however, may be that players felt they would always be, as phihag put it, driving "against a well-prepared receiver with good reflexes just [giving] them more power and speed to return, going downwards" and that having that extra shaft angle constraint did not allow them to gain the advantage they now perceive they have.

    Personally, I don't see that there is such a big difference in the advantage between the new and old rules. I think under either, a drive might work once per match and the second attempt would be severely punished by a ready opponent. However, I am firmly convinced that under the former rules, both the first and second attempts would be faulted by BWF service judges.
     
    #583 event, Jul 1, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2018
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  4. event

    event Regular Member

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    If you mean misleading about the disadvantage claimed by taller players, I agree. I don't think the waistbands affect our judgment of where their ribs are, though.
     
  5. s_mair

    s_mair Regular Member

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    We only have to watch Viktor's latest matches under the new service height rule to see that his serve has barely changed at all. At least I didn't notice that his serve got attacked more than in the past (let's face the truth - his serve has never been the tightest to say the least...). And as far as I have seen, he has stopped attacking the new rule via social media in the past months.
     
  6. GingerCorslette

    GingerCorslette Regular Member

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    Come on man, Viktor a legit good player, but his serve wasn't any better before the rule change either way
     
  7. phihag

    phihag Regular Member

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    Did you intend to post that? This press release from BWF is from 2017. @Master already posted it in this very thread.

    In any case, if you post somebody else's words, you should include proper attribution, and mark the text as such.
     
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  8. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    @rajuu

    You posted some of this before.

    It's already old news. You might want to examine that time machine of yours :)
     
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  9. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    I think the fault called on the drive serves before this new service rule was more on the racket pointing direction (not pointing downward from the service judge's point of view)
    And as the racket pointing direction is no longer an issue, there is no more reason to fault the drive serves except if it was hit above 1.15m.
     
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  10. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    Yah, my rhetorical question was trying to elicit this answer from Cheung, but he somehow didn't follow.

    Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk
     
  11. OhSearsTower

    OhSearsTower Regular Member

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    to be very clear once again for me as i am not sure i understand your discussion correctly:

    You can now serve with the racket pointing upwards? It would be legal now?
     
  12. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    You pretty much can do anything with your racket pointing direction as long as it is under 1.15m when it touches the shuttle.
     
  13. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    @phihag
    Is that correct?

    Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk
     
  14. phihag

    phihag Regular Member

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    In spirit yes, but not precisely. The whole shuttle must be below 1.15m when it is hit during the serve.

    The racket can indeed be upwards, sidewards, downwards, or any other direction, at any height.
     
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  15. OhSearsTower

    OhSearsTower Regular Member

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    thank you

    now i understand correctly (the feathers below 1.15m too..alright)
     
  16. OhSearsTower

    OhSearsTower Regular Member

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    thank you

    now i understand correctly (the feathers below 1.15m too..alright)
     
  17. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    If there were no service judge around to look through the glass panels with the double lines, how could you tell you are actually serving below 1.15m or not?
     
  18. phihag

    phihag Regular Member

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    Same way you judged previously - estimate where the line is, and call fault if the shuttle is over, bearing in mind §6.7 ITTO, i.e. not calling if in doubt. If the fixed service height rule persists, BWF, the continental associations, the national federations, and manufacturers may also add additional helpers, for instance a small line on the net.

    Note that BWF already announced that they'd let the other associations&federations decide whether to adopt the fixed service height. Even BWF itself excepted the World Junior Championships from the fixed height service law. So it's certainly not outside the realm of possibilities that some/many/all national federations continue to use the pre-2018 lowest rib + racket angle service laws for quite some time.
     
    #598 phihag, Jul 27, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2018
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  19. lurker

    lurker Regular Member

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    this 1.15m service rule,
    as long as the shuttle is hit within the stipulated height, and flicks will do? no more 'racket head pointing up' issues?
     
  20. Ch1k0

    Ch1k0 Regular Member

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    Yes. As long as you can keep below the line the racket can be in any direction.

    Sent from my LG-H930 using Tapatalk
     
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