Indonesia Badminton

j4ckie said:
I'm saying a sports association is massively hypocritical if they accept sponsorships from companies that focus on products that are immensely detrimental to your health and cause the deaths of millions. There is not even a 'responsible' amount to consume cigarettes in. Even alcoholic beverages as sponsors are somewhat iffy imop, but there's at least some plausible deniability there (no health detriment proven in small amounts).
Personally, I'd be okay with governments banning tobacco because of the health detriment and massive costs it causes (all those cancer patients, for example), but I'm not saying it must be done (other substances should be unbanned in that event though). I don't think banning them from sponsoring sporting teams via law is quite necessary, but Im pretty sure no sporting association in the developed world allows it.
Whatever. I don't really care that much one way or another, but I'll consider all athletes and sports associations who accept that kind of sponsorship massive hypocrites and morally bankrupt. They're basically whores for whoever wants to put their logo on them if they accept sponsorships that are diametrically opposed to everything they do and should stand for.
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And another one that has worldwide effect : http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/201812/19/WS5c19dc96a3107d4c3a001a55.html
 
j4ckie said:
I'm saying a sports association is massively hypocritical if they accept sponsorships from companies that focus on products that are immensely detrimental to your health and cause the deaths of millions. There is not even a 'responsible' amount to consume cigarettes in. Even alcoholic beverages as sponsors are somewhat iffy imop, but there's at least some plausible deniability there (no health detriment proven in small amounts).
Personally, I'd be okay with governments banning tobacco because of the health detriment and massive costs it causes (all those cancer patients, for example), but I'm not saying it must be done (other substances should be unbanned in that event though). I don't think banning them from sponsoring sporting teams via law is quite necessary, but Im pretty sure no sporting association in the developed world allows it.
Whatever. I don't really care that much one way or another, but I'll consider all athletes and sports associations who accept that kind of sponsorship massive hypocrites and morally bankrupt. They're basically whores for whoever wants to put their logo on them if they accept sponsorships that are diametrically opposed to everything they do and should stand for.
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Yeah yeah everyone knows it's all just pretty talk. It is that pitiful and dreadful the condition and situation in Indonesia. So, what real and practical solutions could you offer to solve this situation for the children?

Beside telling all the kids in the school who received or trying out for the scholarships that they are all basically whores? Sold by their family to the school because they dream of being a pro athlete but their family are just too poor to give them all the facilities. At least it's something more respectable to have a dream to be a top pro player so they can support themselves and their family than being criminals, beggars or corruptors. Or you want them to be sold to a crime organizations instead?

We are all ears to hear anything.
 
yuquall said:
Yeah yeah everyone knows it's all just pretty talk. It is that pitiful and dreadful the condition and situation in Indonesia. So, what real and practical solutions could you offer to solve this situation for the children?

Beside telling all the kids in the school who received or trying out for the scholarships that they are all basically whores? Sold by their family to the school because they dream of being a pro athlete but their family are just too poor to give them all the facilities. At least it's something more respectable to have a dream to be a top pro player so they can support themselves and their family than being criminals, beggars or corruptors. Or you want them to be sold to a crime organizations instead?

We are all ears to hear anything.
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Obviously when I say athletes I mean adults who can choose themselves. And as I said, I don't care much either way. I just don't respect an athlete with a proud sign of an addictive and deadly product on their chest. Simple as that. They're free to do as they wish.
A child can't even properly comprehend the concept of a sponsorship, let alone the scope of what cigarettes do to some people's health and lives. They probably only think about badminton in that scholarship. My opinion obviously doesn't apply to them - but rather the adults that make the decision to let/make them wear that sponsored shirt with that brand name on it. If the guy sponsoring all this really just cares about the sport and those children, he'd have no problem simply taking off the brand name. I suspect there is a bit more to this than simple altruism, though. I'm also guessing there isn't a single person deciding this anymore, and this is actually managed and decided by managers, just like most big companies, so I'm not assuming anything about the original owner of the company - for all we know he legitimately just wanted to do sth for the sport. It's irrelevant to the matter at hand - right now they most definitely care about the image boost this sponsorship gives them.
 
j4ckie said:
Obviously when I say athletes I mean adults who can choose themselves. And as I said, I don't care much either way. I just don't respect an athlete with a proud sign of an addictive and deadly product on their chest. Simple as that. They're free to do as they wish.
A child can't even properly comprehend the concept of a sponsorship, let alone the scope of what cigarettes do to some people's health and lives. They probably only think about badminton in that scholarship. My opinion obviously doesn't apply to them - but rather the adults that make the decision to let/make them wear that sponsored shirt with that brand name on it. If the guy sponsoring all this really just cares about the sport and those children, he'd have no problem simply taking off the brand name. I suspect there is a bit more to this than simple altruism, though. I'm also guessing there isn't a single person deciding this anymore, and this is actually managed and decided by managers, just like most big companies, so I'm not assuming anything about the original owner of the company - for all we know he legitimately just wanted to do sth for the sport. It's irrelevant to the matter at hand - right now they most definitely care about the image boost this sponsorship gives them.
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It surely does and that's why it wasn't them who get enraged but mostly the badminton fans instead who defended the school.
Many even though not cigarettes fans couldn't accept what the child association did to disgrace the school. The school had tried to not involve the children into their branding in the public audition (and actually agreed to take off djarum's name from the audition and to not give the t-shirts to the kids) but still retain the school's name on the staff (coaches who are all adults).

And again in this case, it's the club's name that the players are proud of wearing on their chest. They grew up with it since they were small. Unless the players personally taking sponsorship directly from any company, I don't see anything wrong.
 
There seems to be a real issue regarding tobacco in Indonesia, especially with the very youngs. In 2011, 1/3 of Indonesians under 10-year-old tried smoking while a million kids under 16 smoke regularly as tobacco sales are opened to minors. I'm not planning to make a thesis on that topic but a quick search can tell there is a tobacco issues among the youngs in Indonesia. I think even if the club is called Djarum Badminton and is not considered by some a cigarette product it is the same name and company behind it. Obviously there's controversy bound to happens as the Indonesian society, like this child association, will want to make a change, rightfully if you ask me...

The article I got all information from is of 2011 so I don't know how the situation evolved since then.

Source::https://abcnews.go.com/Health/age-children-smoking-indonesia/story?id=14464140
 
LenaicM said:
There seems to be a real issue regarding tobacco in Indonesia, especially with the very youngs. In 2011, 1/3 of Indonesians under 10-year-old tried smoking while a million kids under 16 smokes regularly as tobacco sales are opened to minors. I'm not planning to make a thesis on that topic but a quick search can tell there is a tobacco issues among the youngs in Indonesia. I think even if the club is called Djarum Badminton and is not considered by some a cigarette product it is the same name and company behind it. Obviously there's controversy bound to happens as the Indonesian society, like this child association, will want to make a change, rightfully if you ask me...

The article I got all information from is of 2011 so I don't know how the situation evolved since then.

Source::https://abcnews.go.com/Health/age-children-smoking-indonesia/story?id=14464140
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All the child association ever do is making comments here and there. But has never done anything concrete enough to actually make a change in the right direction.

You should come and see what real issues are troubling the children in Indonesia. Getting all children equal opportunities to proper education should be one of the things on their priority list.
Tobacco company funding legit public audition held by a badminton school for scholarships should be the last in their long check list, if they really want to make good change. Not just by making statements that provoking public's anger but putting their concerns to actions on the real problems.

Now, all they did was disgracing the clubl in public and stopping the club doing annual public auditions in many cities. But nothing has changed really.
 
yuquall said:
All the child association ever do is making comments here and there. But has never done anything concrete enough to actually make a change in the right direction.

You should come and see what real issues are troubling the children in Indonesia. Getting all children equal opportunities to proper education should be one of the things on their priority list.
Tobacco company funding legit public audition held by a badminton school for scholarships should be the last in their long check list, if they really want to make good change. Not just by making statements that provoking public's anger but putting their concerns to actions on the real problems.

Now, all they did was disgracing the clubl in public and stopping the club doing annual public auditions in many cities. But nothing has changed really.
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I don't think I could understand the situation unless with better knowledge of it I'm afraid. But may be it's a start for this child association and I'm sure their power is quite limited. It would be up to the government to take measures regarding the education issue you mentioned. I doubt an association can solve it all. It's just here to give some pointers and somehow provoke to get public awareness. I have only been to Bali, which is so different than the rest of Indonesia, for 2 weeks and do not have enough knowledge of the Indonesian society to discuss this issue any deeper. I still believe associating a cigarette brand with sport and furthermore young athletes is not right.
 
LenaicM said:
I don't think I could understand the situation unless with better knowledge of it I'm afraid. But may be it's a start for this child association and I'm sure their power is quite limited. It would be up to the government to take measures regarding the education issue you mentioned. I doubt an association can solve it all. It's just here to give some pointers and somehow provoke to get public awareness. I have only been to Bali, which is so different than the rest of Indonesia, for 2 weeks and do not have enough knowledge of the Indonesian society to discuss this issue any deeper. I still believe associating a cigarette brand with sport and furthermore young athletes is not right.
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Tobacco with children is definitely not good. No one is denying that.

I still disagree with the association whatever their real intention is. It's been a tricky political year and seems like it's not going to be over anytime soon.
 
j4ckie said:
I just don't respect an athlete with a proud sign of an addictive and deadly product on their chest.
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...like sugar? would a company like nestle\m&m mars\coca-cola be any better? for climate's sake what about oil companies like 'total' sponsoring major tournaments? would tech companies or clothing mfg companies that exploit labor be better?

what is the 'line' regarding which companies are socially responsible enough to accept their money? hell, where's the line of acceptable companies waiting to even give enough money?

the djarum situation might be a nec'y evil right now in regards to the amount of money involved. can another company, or a number of companies, match their total financial contribution? i wish i knew. now that the pressure is on we'll find out sooner or later...
 
I have read a few articles about Praveen Jordan’s recent disciplinary issues (late night out, awol in training). I have always liked Jordan, who has both power and skills. But he doesn’t seem very popular among Indonesian fans. Am I right? Do people think he has underachieved?
 
Hbmao said:
I have read a few articles about Praveen Jordan’s recent disciplinary issues (late night out, awol in training). I have always liked Jordan, who has both power and skills. But he doesn’t seem very popular among Indonesian fans. Am I right? Do people think he has underachieved?
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I like Jordan too. Other players in the past sometimes have discipline issue as well, like Tontowi.

Hopefully Jordan would wake up, talent alone can't win.
 
Not that he has underachieved but he has underachieved since winning AllEngland2016 , thats irritating to me. Its just like a pair that win WC and after that, just cant do anything plus he is so talented imo. That Final is such a joy to watch.

Hopefully he can show that he isnt finished and can get a medal at Tokyo. Of course if its Olympic title , life will be changed.
 
Leo/Daniel have just won WJC. Truly a new potential for INA MD. INA MD never lose its stock.

Watch out, world! INA MD won't die down anytime soon.
 
minions said:
Leo/Daniel have just won WJC. Truly a new potential for INA MD. INA MD never lose its stock.

Watch out, world! INA MD won't die down anytime soon.
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CHN had won many WJCs before and look how they turned up in seniors. We'll see soon after a year or so.
 
minions said:
Leo/Daniel have just won WJC. Truly a new potential for INA MD. INA MD never lose its stock.

Watch out, world! INA MD won't die down anytime soon.
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From now on coach herry and aryono will take care of leo/daniel, they gonna be scary in the future.
 
yuquall said:
CHN had won many WJCs before and look how they turned up in seniors. We'll see soon after a year or so.
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True that, even GMT was dubbed the next Susi Susanti after she won WJC. It's been two years since she turned senior and still struggling.

But INA have a very good MD coaches, one of the best in business. I'm pretty sure they can do something good with this pair.
 
So disappointing... every single MS, WS, WD and XD in pelatnas except Jordan/Melati are all out in Dens Open.


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Finally, PraMel beat Zheng/Huang for the first time. They nearly did it in AE. This time, they really did it. Guess giving ultimatum for them to reach target works. They must have realized what they can really do if they eliminate any non technical issues that they still have.

Btw, this is the second time Zheng/Huang lost before reaching SF. Both times are done by INA XD pairs.
 
minions said:
Finally, PraMel beat Zheng/Huang for the first time. They nearly did it in AE. This time, they really did it. Guess giving ultimatum for them to reach target works. They must have realized what they can really do if they eliminate any non technical issues that they still have.

Btw, this is the second time Zheng/Huang lost before reaching SF. Both times are done by INA XD pairs.
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Wonder if we have hawkeye yesterday, what would be the result?
 
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