Chinese Badminton

Discussion in 'China Professional Players' started by Justin L, Aug 31, 2013.

  1. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    The Chinese article avoided mentioning anything about Zhang Ning, whether she's fired or demoted, but I guessed as much since Luo Yigang is promoted while Zhang Ning's name is not talked about (probably awaiting final confirmation). Thanks to @alien9113 for posting that piece of news (though the author didn't cite his source).
     
  2. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    As Li Zhifeng is handling Lin Dan, at least until Tokyo 2020, my pick is Zhao Jianhua or Sun Jun, esp since the latter was invited to help coach Chen Long and Shi Yuqi for the Thomas Cup and probably extended until the Nanjing WC and the Asian Games,I supposed.
     
  3. alien9113

    alien9113 Regular Member

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    I think players need some stability. Keep changing coaches will not help, as each coach has his/her own style. Malaysia is prime example. Look at what's going on at their coaching side.

    I think the WS players need some conditioning to keep pace with the current game. Watching the Chinese against the rest, I think they are a tad slower. Strategy and tactically wise, I don't think Zhang Ning did a bad job. But strategy and tactics can only keep the opponent away for some time. If they can't keep up, then losing is the only choice.
     
  4. pcll99

    pcll99 Regular Member

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    Thanks.

    Li Zhifeng is a very senior coach at the national squad. A coach of that seniority should not be coaching one single player exclusively.

    Sun Jun should be helping everyone in the men's singles: Chen Long, SYQ, Lin Dan, etc.

    China's women's singles is in extremely dire situation and it's urgent. Luo Yigang is untested and cannot possibly deliver immediate result for Nanjing World Championship 2018 and Asian Games.

    Li Zhifeng on the other hand knows national squad and the women's singles team very well. If he is willing to return to the women's singles team, he is the perfect choice to help and guide Luo Yigang.
     
    #1544 pcll99, Jun 13, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2018
  5. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    http://sports.sina.com.cn/others/badmin/2018-06-13/doc-ihcwpcmq4277137.shtml

    The above Chinese article also confirmed Luo Yigang's appointment and promotion as the coach for the CHN WS 1st Team but denied that Zhang Ning has been replaced, as told by one of the unnamed national coaches who added that we should await Xia Xuanze and Zhang Jun's public announcement for confirmation soon.

    [​IMG]
    File-photo of Luo Yigang
     
  6. pcll99

    pcll99 Regular Member

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    This is getting very interesting.

    If Luo is not there to "replace" Zhang Ning. What exactly is his role? What will happen to Zhang Ning?
     
  7. CLELY

    CLELY Regular Member

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    Luo Yigang is former CHN MS in 90's era, same generation with Sun Jun and Dong Jiong. He isn't quite successful in badminton career, only bagged CHN National Games gold medal in 2001 beat teenager Lin Dan in final at that time.
    From Chen Jin (2016 Rio OG failure) to Zhang Ning (2018 Uber Cup disastrous outing) then lesser-known Luo Yigang, let's see how China WS will be transformed...
     
  8. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    http://sports.sina.com.cn/others/badmin/2018-06-15/doc-ihcyszrz8517588.shtml (I translated only the parts on Xie Zhihua and Cai Yun's takes on the plight of CHN WS and their Uber Cup'18 downfall)

    Xie Zhihua (the China-born Thai coach of Intanon Ratchanok) originally guessed that He Bingjiao would play WS2 (in the semifinal match with Thailand), "because He Bingjiao has a superior record against Thai players." The author specially looked up the relevant H2H records - HBJ vs Nichaon Jindapol is 2 - 0, undefeated, both matches played in 2016; even if it's versus Busanan Ongbamrungphan, HBJ's record is clearly advantageous, 4 - 1, winning the last four encounters.

    As to why He Bingjiao was not fielded in that tie, CHN's Singles Head Coach, Xia Xuanze, had already given his explanation:" Earlier in the preparation stage, indeed He Bingjiao was selected as the WS2, but during training there was a little mishap, she injured her ankle. After a period of therapy, she recovered fairly well. In the preliminary rounds, we tried her out, let her run about to see how it goes, as her training was disrupted for more than 10 days, but from her performance in the preliminaries, we could tell there was still some problems with her leg."

    However, Xie Zhihua has his own thoughts on this matter, he candidly expressed to Sina Sports:" Actually I felt that they could still let He Bingjiao play WS2 and have Gao Fangjie as WS3. Also I have no idea of Li Xuerui's extent of recovery but from that match she played (against Busanan), I think she hadn't recovered well, her movement was much slower than before. Based on our expert observations, we can tell she looked apprehensive while running about. For such an important match, we need to have a physically and mentally fit player, I felt that Li Xuerui should not be fielded that day. Li Xuerui gave me the impression that the will is there, but not the strength (the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak), she had misgivings while running about, I could tell from the match that her mobility on court was no good."

    Now, why do CHN Women's Singles fall to such a state ? Xie Zhihua voiced his personal views: " My coaches have also said, it's because they did not attach importance to nurturing the junior players previously, not meticulous enough in tactics and techniques training. Now a 'gap' has arisen, this time many players are appearing for the first time (in such a major event)."

    When asked "why have CHN WS fallen into such a predicament", Cai Yun also gave his own views:" After all, I am not inside the system/organization, my understanding may not be comprehensive, but Women's Singles as far as their talent-spotting and selection is concerned has indeed been facing a challenging situation. Some coaches have told me, nowadays the number of players for selection to turn professional is small, in addition, the training regime for singles is boring, arduous, the talent pool has actually diminished."

    How do we change the situation as quickly as possible? Facing this question from Sina Sports, Cai Yun's response was " strengthen player's adaptability and ability to resolve problems, increase shot variation, have a wider repertoire of strokes. Nowadays women's singles play at an increasing pace, therefore the technique to control the fast rallies has to improve. Furthermore, young players must not lose their vigour and dynamism! "
     
    #1548 Justin L, Jun 15, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2018
    Cheung, vixter and pcll99 like this.
  9. Baddyforall

    Baddyforall Regular Member

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    Zhang Ning fired

    http://www.badzine.net/2018/06/zhang-ning-fired/

    Excerpts:

    The recent Uber Cup disastrous outing for China will leave one woman down. According to Hong Kong’s South China Morning Post, Zhang Ning, head coachfor the women’s singles team, has been fired from the coaching staff after her players failed to deliver in Bangkok last month.

    Who will take over?

    [​IMG]
    If Xia Xuanze, who is from the same generation of Zhang Ning – saved his spot as head coach of the men’s singles team after China’s brilliant win in the Thomas Cup, Zhang Ning didn’t have the same luck and will be replaced by 43-year-old Luo Yigang
     
  10. raymond

    raymond Regular Member

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    Whether ZN would stay or not, it seems Chinese Women's team needs some changes, presumably something in their training. They should have many more raw talents to select from, yet watching matches in recent years, something is missing. Do they have to wait for TTY to retire (a rather long wait) before they could climb back to top spots?
     
  11. alien9113

    alien9113 Regular Member

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    Easier said than done. They are quite at odds with each other. You can't control when you are slow. You can't choose shots if you aren't in control.

    My guess is, they will probably have to return back to basics - footwork, strokes. Tactics and strategy will probably come in later, possibly when there is significant improvements in these 2 areas to execute them.
     
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  12. Baddyforall

    Baddyforall Regular Member

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    They have to handle many girls at the top not only TTY. They are struggling against many. If they beat one, there are many more in the block to defeat them.
    Only way is to start from the scratch. Not the way they are doing it now.
    Sacking Zhang Ning is not a right move. Male Coaches will definitely struggle to bring Women Singles players.
     
  13. pcll99

    pcll99 Regular Member

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    i guess Zhang Ning has not be sacked. But her role within the national team will change. Just speculating.
     
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  14. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    http://sports.sina.com.cn/others/badmin/2018-06-21/doc-ihefphqk6794826.shtml

    It is reported today at the felicitations ceremony that Nozomi Okuhara expressed that , compared to her personal complete 6-0 victories, helping her team to win the Uber Cup is of utmost importance, " It's our strongest lineup in history, behind me is the formidable women's doubles as our support, that's why we can play more relaxed,therefore capturing the championship is a very natural outcome." She emphasized the overall strength of the JPN team is top of the list, before the tournament they were already brimming with confidence to seize the crown.

    Additionally, Nozomi Okuhara has proclaimed that JPN Women's Team has completely surpassed CHN Women's and henceforth can occupy the hegemonic position for years. " This is also what we strive for , to fight for and win multiple golds at the Tokyo Olympics."

    At the same time, Kento Momota who at the Thomas Cup broke through beating many top-notched players, stated:" This Thomas and Uber Cups fully displayed the formidable strength of the JPN Team, hereafter (I) will work hard to become even stronger, let those watching me play feel joyful and valorous."

    [Hear that, Team China - Justin L]
     
  15. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    I'm getting more impressed with Cai Yanyan and think she is the next bright young CHN WS prospects together with Gao Fangjie.

    This time I have a feeling CYY may soon outstrip GFJ as the former appears to me to be a bit more consistent and a thinking player with decisive stroke execution in both offense and defense, even her unforced errors are seldom wild shots whilst the latter whom I'm still banking on for the big-time one day is yet somewhat inconsistent and at times temperamental in the sense of playing according to her moods.

    Tomorrow, at the CAN Open WTS100 Quarterfinals, the two ladies will clash again after the US Open last week where GFJ prevailed in R2. For this occasion, I'll be rooting for CYY to avenge that defeat and hopefully progress to the final provided she overcomes Sayaka Takahashi , her likely semifinal opponent.
     
  16. antssantss

    antssantss Regular Member

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    Apart from Lu Guangzu the rest of the china juniors are not up to the mark. The CBA should create another team of juniors to play in tournaments around the world.Giving exposure to the 17,18 and19 year olds may produce another talent. Whenever one of the juniors are playing apart from LG, you get the feeling they are not going to win. HY ,ZZ and ZJP haven't advanced their play and should be dropped in favour of the younger players.
     
  17. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    Yes, Huang Yuxiang , just like Qiao Bin, has so many years of international exposure and has so little to show for - seriously, I doubt they will do any better than the seemingly 'retired or demoted or relegated' (still no confirmation from the Chinese media yet) Tian Houwei and would probably suffer the same fate.

    As for 20-year-old Zhou Zeqi, born 18 September 1997, still premature to write him off as, to be fair, he's been given little international exposure, much less than the two above-mentioned. I'll wait another three years for him to make his mark

    22-year-old Zhao Junpeng has a bit more exposure than ZZQ, so, yes, he's somewhat disappointing for a CHN player. I'd give him another 2 to 3 years to make or break his professional career.

    And there's the former WJC, 20-year-old Sun Feixiang, he still has good potential, too early to write him off; similarly, give him , say, three years to prove himself.

    I'm using roughly three years as a benchmark in view of what 22-year-old Shi Yuqi has achieved now after about that length of time in the pro circuit after his transition from the junior circuit where he captured the Nanjing Olympics '14 gold. Generally, going by tradition, I take it that China players can't afford to wait , say, five years or so to start showing reasonable or commendable results by CBA's standards.
     
    #1557 Justin L, Jun 22, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2018
  18. antssantss

    antssantss Regular Member

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    I accept that ZZ at 20 still has an opportunity to improve. But you need to have talent and I don't think he has exhibited this quality so far.Without natural talent you can't change their poor habits, not to mention mental strength etc. At 18 years old, K. Momota has already shown his talent and potential.By keeping these mediocre players on, you are not giving the younger players a chance to get into tournaments. If you want to keep these players on, then form another group of 4 to 5 juniors that have completed the junior championships but not in the national team. Then they can fit in nicely when they perform well.
    I think those players who haven't perform, like TH,HY,ZJ and even ZZ have a wealth of experience. They can be employed by the CBA as a group that will spar with the 16-18 year old juniors and impart their playing experience. They are not coaches but Sparring partners.
     
  19. antssantss

    antssantss Regular Member

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    I am afraid Chen Yufei's game is suspect. She doesn't know the strength of the opponents game. She was caught at least 8 times by Nozomi's favourite dropshot. I am sure her coaches would have warned her about that and taught her to expect it at some point in the rally. It explains also why she has such a poor game at the net. Finally she is a little panicky and makes silly mistakes when she has the upper hand. I am afraid she won't make it to the top with these sort of weak skills.
     
  20. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

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    In G3, Chen Yufei was outsmarted and outplayed, suddenly clueless unlike in G1 where Nozomi actually didn't play badly to lose it.

    I mean, if every time CYF thought she plays a good shot and it comes back , and she has to think 'what next?' or simply goes by instinct and hopes for the best , then she's not a thinking player and certainly not experienced enough to follow up and strings her shots together without much thinking, in which case she still has some way to go to beat the top few.

    To be fair, Chen Yufei really played well in G1 when Nozomi hadn't settled in yet, and later, perhaps, CYF could be having some issues with her physicality, her nose or something before the start of G2, then needing medical attention in G3 for her right leg.

    Nevertheless, when she's playing well, she has the speed and accuracy as well as the patience to take on Nozomi, but lost way the next two sets, esp in the decider, as Nozomi tightened her game to control most of the rallies.

    Clearly, CYF has to improve on reading the game better and that takes quite a bit of experience, and the way to gain experience is, well, play more actively and learn to study and analyse the opponents' game, and then implement some of the tactics and strategies to counter it during training with the coaches' help but, ultimately, it's how you are able to apply it on court at tournaments that counts. To do that also requires the right mentality, not only lots of practice and knowledge of the game. The mentality part is the hardest to train, if at all possible.

    After all , it's actual tournament conditions against real opponents that make or break a player, the litmus test that determines a player's true abilities. My 2 cents.
     

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