Building attacks in mixed doubles

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by Evanplaysbadminton, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. Evanplaysbadminton

    Evanplaysbadminton New Member

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    Hello,

    I would like to get some advices on how to play in mixed double as a guy. I started to play about a year and half ago and got serious with tournaments like 8 months ago.

    At first, it was really easy because I would smash everything and I reached another category very quickly. Basically, I would play like level doubles when I'm at the rear. But now it's more difficult and I'm wondering what I could do.


    What should I do when I have the attack backwards ?

    Usually, my partner serves, the opponent lifts, I smash, smash, smash... But I wonder if it's a good idea to start smashing at the third shot ?

    People always tell me to "build the point", but I don't know what it means. If I see an opportunity, I try to take it, when I watch top players like Zheng, it's like they smash whatever is lifted. But maybe my smash is weak...
    Some players told me I should clear to "build the point". I don't get why would I clear when we have the initiative and we're not late. I've been taught to avoid clears except for real emergencies.

    But I've been trying to change and use more dropshots, especially slices and cross dropshots but it's like I'm doing that randomly with no plan. I usually try this right on the third shot and maybe this is why it's not working ? Maybe I should wait and shouldn't attack immediately at the third shot ? And do something like drop shot/drop shot/smash ? Or smash/smash/reversed-slice ?
    Sometimes also, when the female opponent is facing me, I try a clear.

    If my partner didn't serve correctly I usually try to aim at the net where the opposite woman is not or lift at her, or on the backhand corner of the guy.

    What should I do when I'm late on a clear/lift ?

    If the shuttle is up in the air but behind me I usually do a drop shot or a crossed drop shot. Is it okay ?
    But when the shuttle is lower in the backcourt, I don't really know, I try to lift but usually I lack length. I try to avoid the woman at the net but at this distance crossing is too slow...

    When I return the serve

    Should I return differently than level doubles ? Some players told me I shouldn't even cross the serve line when I return the opponent serve ?
    I've already been told to aim for the sides lines in mid court, or aim between or at the players. But it's not easy because sometimes I'm late because I don't stand exactly behind the serve line. I'm always afraid to get a flick and I'm bad at returning flicks because I'm late...
    I also do some drives in a deep corner but some players seem to disagree with this technique ? I don't see why because it seems effective at my level.

    Also, should I move backwards immediately after I returned the serve ? A national player taught me I should return close to the net and move backwards to be in attacking position, but when I watch some top players, they don't move backwards immediately after their return, they move a little bit, but they stay on their side instead of going behind their partner. The guy places himself near his partner, kinda like side to side.

    Do you have any other tips, please ? Because I try to apply all of this but still it's not working. Also, I should mention, I don't have the same female partner every time and most of the times, they only go for a tight net shot... they rarely try to push or intercept...
    Also, what should I do when the lady is behind after a flick ? Usually I put myself at the centre but not as close to the net as in levels because I expect her to come back which never happens except if she's experienced... Maybe I should position myself in a position to cover tight net shots ? But in this case my partner would stay behind, and most female partners I have don't wanna hear anything about switching positions when I'm at the net...

    From what I get, maybe I should cross more and be more patient instead of smashing right ahead ? I usually want to make a decisive shot when I return the serve or when the opponent lifts. I'm a bit puzzled... Don't know if I should wait or attack immediately, play straight, cross, some players suggested that I play stick smashes or fast drop shots also...

    Thank you very much for your help ! I'm sorry it's a lot but I tried to ask some players where I play, there are usually pretty evasive... "aim for the sidelines", "smash at the girl", "smash between the players". I was expecting the coaches to teach us what to do when the opponent makes this shot or if we're in this position or if they are in that position but I only get informations from youtube and google...
     
    #1 Evanplaysbadminton, Jan 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
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  2. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Mixed doubles is actually quite hard. There’s a lot of subtlety in it.

    For building the point tactics, I would actually recommend watching Chris Adcock of England. Zheng Siwei style can’t be copied because he’s like supercharged turbo speed and we are mere mortals.

    Building the point means manoeuvring the opponents around the court keeping them guessing. At some point in the future, you’ll be playing better opponents who can get your smashes back consistently and you won’t have a different set of tactics to fall back on. Hence, it would be good to develop a plan B game style.

    Clears - try experimenting with them, especially to ladies who have poor backward movement, more rarely to the guy’s. It’s pretty easy to see the result.
     
  3. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Since there are a lot of questions, I would advise you to divide each question into a separate thread. That will help keep the answers organised as there’s potentially a lot of information.
     
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  4. BadBadmintonPlayer

    BadBadmintonPlayer Regular Member

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    I think your problem is the level of your opponents.

    Usually your partner serves and the oppenent is pushing the shuttlecock or places it on the net. A lift from opponent is wrong! So there is normally a fight for the attack at the first rallies. The first ones to play lift are almost always automatically on the defensive.

    Opponents lifts? Start your attack! Thats smash, drop and sometimes a flat attack-clear. Only when you are under pressure can you slow down the game again or give up the attack.

    This is the normal match plan in badminton. Especially in Singles you build up a point much more carefully, because you have to cover much more and the opponent can often counter dangerously. In Mixed, your front covers the lady and you can attack more safely.


    Every single situation cannot be described here. But there are things which are normally good and which one should rather not use or should only be used very rarely.

    In mixed games the lady is often the target. You try to push the lady to the back and that works well with an attack-clear for example. If you manage to get the lady in the back to answer with her backhand, you've practically won the point at lower levels.

    The second thing is to see what works for your opponents. Backhand is usually worse. Playing mixed points often works well.


    These are for example 3 good attack possibilities:
    [​IMG]
    - bring the man forward with a drop.
    - smash for a direct point or to generate a better situation
    - attacking clear to the backhand from lady
     
    #4 BadBadmintonPlayer, Jan 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
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  5. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    Mixed doubles is the most fun discipline. It is much more tactical than others.

    If you are given the opportunity to smash/attack, you should take it. If your attack is not getting through, then it is not effective enough because:

    your smash is too weak
    you're smashing placement is wrong
    your opponent defense is too strong

    none of which can be solve with clearing.
     
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  6. Evanplaysbadminton

    Evanplaysbadminton New Member

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    @Cheung
    Thanks. Yes, I follow the Adcock team even if he's left handed. I also enjoy very much Watanabe/Higashino but also left-handed.
    I've DMed you about the thread.

    @BadBadmintonPlayer Thanks, man. Well, I play at a low level actually. I started championships like a year ago only. I'm taking private lessons but more for singles...
    Yeah, everytime the opponent lifts I attack. But I'll keep in mind to start with a drop before once in a while to bring the man forward and maybe clear behind him or on his female partner to disorganize them. Thanks for the 3 examples, I've actually never thought about clearing on the female backhand.

    @kwun
    I think you're right, my smash may be weak. By wrong smashing placement do you mean I may take it too much above my head ? A national player told me I shouldn't smash above my head but on my right with my arm at a 45 degree angle. But usually I find myself under the shuttle...
     
  7. BadBadmintonPlayer

    BadBadmintonPlayer Regular Member

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    Badminton is a strategy game. Try to have different options in your head and try them out in the game. If you notice that attack clears on the lady work well, then use them more often. If not, then use them less. Be flexible and test things. But from good positions you should smash mostly.

    Smashing placement means where you place your Smash to your opponent. In the middle of your opponent? To the sides? If your opponent is in imbalance, on the body or shoulder area?

    A perfect Smash is something on the right side of the body. There are good tutorials on Youtube.
     
  8. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    If both sides are at the similar level technique and strength-wise, then lifting is almost always bad in mixed doubles, the attacking side will be able to isolate and attack the girl.

    Most of mixed double is actually not about attack but instead, lots of drops, pushes, drives to various very tactical locations in order to find weakness in your opponents formation, and then forces a lift and the smash is the rally ending moves.

    However, if the the level between the 2 sides are uneven, eg, if one side weaker in attack or stronger in attack, then the balance will be skewed and the weaker side can easily be overwhelmed.
     
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  9. Budi

    Budi Regular Member

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    At lower level, smash almost always be a winning shot coz beginner had bad untrained skill & reflex so any smash would be like a bullet speed to them.
    Higher level, smash rarely become a winning shot as any hard smash is still as clear as seeing an elephant.

    So why use smash when its never be a winning shot? You smash so that the opponent return a bad bird where your partner could do the finishing blow.

    I cant say going for smash on 3rd stroke is good or not, but what bad is if its obvious you would do smash on the 3rd stroke & your opponent will always be ready for it. Im proud of my smash & before i will almost always smash any high bird coming to me no matter what. Yes, my powerfull smash in the end will broke opponent defense but it cost me alot of stamina & my 2nd round would be ruined. Nowadays i mix my hard smash with drop or lift or flat drive which makes my shot more unpredictable rather than obvious hard smash.
     
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  10. Dangho

    Dangho Regular Member

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    Building the attack doesn't end with the smash. If you get a lift with puts you even slightly off perfect balance, you put yourself and your partner in trouble if you full smash. Kim Dong Moon once said that mixed doubles achieves is about protecting the girl. Chris Adcock is a great at this. Gabby is good at the net but doesn't cover very much. You rarely see Chris going for big smashes but instead he goes for angle and creative shots getting a better and better opportunity. You should be cautious to play too relentlessly if you don't have a godly female partner
     
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  11. Evanplaysbadminton

    Evanplaysbadminton New Member

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    Hey, thanks for all the advices.
    I'll keep in mind about trying to smash less, or not all the time and try to create spaces, smash placement, and working on my smash.

    Cheung suggested I should open separate threads so I've made new ones.
     
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  12. Cesium

    Cesium Regular Member

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    Smashing is good! Getting them to lift is the hard part lol
     

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