The way I string badminton racket... Simplified Haribito???

Discussion in 'Badminton Stringing Techniques & Tools' started by stradrider, Jun 5, 2020.

  1. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    Hi guys!

    Badminton central was my home for learning all kind of badminton things including stringing! Basically the way I do it mixed up of all kind of things I have seen here and there. I thought may be I should try to put my own video up for a critique... All comments are welcome!

    Since I have been a bit of a "smartas", telling others what to do... - may be it's the time to get my own bottom handed to me???

    In my head I imagine it as a simplified "Haribito" pattern, but not sure if this is the right way to call it?

    If, at the same time, someone finds something useful in there, I will be very glad as well!
     
  2. tjiew

    tjiew Regular Member

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    This is a Gosen Haribito basic pattern.

    Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk
     
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  3. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    thanks!
     
  4. deepinthemusic

    deepinthemusic Regular Member

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    Mate, i dont know about that machine, but after it pulled the tension, dont you think you have to keep the racket still before you clamp the string or you lose a bit tension? In my crank machine, gotta move fast and steady not the move the racket..
     
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  5. tjiew

    tjiew Regular Member

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    The tension won't lose. The reason is that it is constant pulling by the tension head. The tension will keep pulling to reach the tension. This is advantage using digital machine, crank tension head won't be able to do that.

    Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk
     
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  6. deepinthemusic

    deepinthemusic Regular Member

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    Didnt know that, and this is applicable to all digital machine? How about wise 2086 tensioner?
     
  7. tjiew

    tjiew Regular Member

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    It will applicable to all digital machine including wide 2086 tensioner. You can go to their website to find more info about their product and the distributors. Kedai Angkasa sport is the only Wise Tension head distributor in Indonesia.

    Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk
     
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  8. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    I think the tension is not a big problem, but I do agree that there is too much wiggling going on... I was stupid and forgot to balance the legs when moved the machine to give more space for the camera. You can see that it literally shakes back and forth all the time.

    It is not a well balanced machine in general, since it's a tabletop machine on the attachable light legs. All the weight is up top... However I do like that it is not a heavy one like some pro machines, also legs are easily removable and so I can just throw it in the car when taking with me on the tournaments.

    However I also very tense myself getting back now after the corona break and too wiggly as well - should work to improve it... May be will try to make another video, see if I can get better..
     
  9. Dekkert

    Dekkert Regular Member

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    I would also think the machine is wiggling a bit too much. Besides that just a minor thing I'm wondering: When preweaving the mains you're double pulling them quite hard through the grommets. Wouldn't that damage the string and/or grommets because of all the friction you're creating? Especially with rougher stings like BG80.
     
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  10. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    Thanks for the comment! I never thought of that, but I think you are correct that there could be a damage to the grommets from the pre-weaving... What would be a better way you think? Pulling one string at a time? Do it slower?

    Yes, for sure the machine is wiggling because the legs were not staying flat on the floor and it was swaying back and forth as a result. Should have stopped the video and fixed it, but wanted to finish the video uninterrupted...
     
  11. s_mair

    s_mair Regular Member

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    Nicely fluent and smooth workflow, looks super solid I would say. I have tried pre-threading a couple of mains too previously, but I just don't like when there are so many loose strings dangling around and getting in the way of the clamp sometimes. So I went back to threading them one after the other, even if pre-threading might save 1-2 minutes in total if everything goes well. Also, I don't think that the machine wiggling is severe. Not sure which stand you're using, but if you look at the balance point of the whole construction with the heavy machine sitting on top of that rod construction, it's hard to avoid the wiggling. Anyways, great video, really enjoyed watching it!
     
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  12. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    Thank you, appreciate that! I will see about pre-weaving... Thought I was very smart about doing it..

    It was awkward at first, even tried using flying clamps to hold the ends tight but barely after couple of string jobs it stopped bothering me at all and I was using it as is. Ends dangling on the floor were disturbing me way more, but mainly, I tried to keep free strings shortest needed and so also tight they stopped being a nuisance. The only thing needed in some spots, to use the other hand to pull a bit the next string to move it out of the way. And it became routine very quickly..

    May be time to experiment a bit more and try again weaving mains one in advance? Hmmm... Did I say that I hate strings dangling on the floor?...:eek:;););)
     
  13. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    I just remembered that the holes in the base of the machine to screw in the stand plate are not in a balancing point - it always tend to tip on one side (to the right of me) when screwing in the stand.

    Was thinking to make a plywood plate in between and move the balance in the better position??? Unless the producers were so smart to make it this way because of something? Or were they that smart? ;)
     
  14. ucantseeme

    ucantseeme Regular Member

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    I like the workflow. What I dislike is that you do the lower part first. Why do I dislike that? From my understanding the Haribito has the advantage that the crosses in the middle get weaved and tensioned first and due the missed few bottom crosses you tension them with less friction which means the end up higher and more uniform tensioned.

    I strung the same way around 5 years back with the bottom crosses first, when I was afraid to break the racket and wasn't so experienced and confident like nowadays. I would like to hear your point of view and theory behind the bottom part first.

    IMO the short side don't disturb me so much when I do the long side first and as said before I always thought the intention of Haribito was (regardless if basic or not) to have less friction and more uniform tension in the middle compared to bottom up or top down. Less string around is a side effect as well, but I don't think this was the main intention.
     
    #14 ucantseeme, Jun 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2020
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  15. deepinthemusic

    deepinthemusic Regular Member

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    Well whaddaya know, i got the owner contact, and he said they sell it but waiting time around 5 weeks, and its a bit out of my price range.. Maybe next year
     
  16. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    double post..
     
    #16 stradrider, Jun 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2020
  17. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    Good question! Yes, I agree that the two ways are quite a bit different. I was thinking about that a bit but please bear in mind...- I am not a good player and therefore my opinion is just an opinion of a guy who thought about it and can recognize a bit how it feels in different ways but not really much more... For sure nothing scientific... :)

    I always thought that Haribito Pro should be theoretically the best way to string and having the middle part of the whole string length in the sweet spot should be best thing evah... In practice it never worked for me, in fact I was disappointed every time I tried. It was ok for two days but than it started feeling uneven and kind of "trampolinish" for some reason. May be some people like it....? May be I did something wrong? I don't know, but it wasn't working for me...

    Here is what I feel and what seems logical in my imagination - in the Haribito Pro variant, when the crosses start at the top going down, the string part where it goes down ends up having more of the middle part of the total string length, and the crosses that start going up end up having the part of the string close to the knot at the top. Are you still with me? o_O

    Another thing, the area above the sweet spot is more important than the area below. Do you agree? First, in general, you are supposed to hit slightly above the center, yes? And also, usually you are more likely to hit closer to the top when out of position, right?

    What happens in Haribito Pro version, in my opinion, string bed getting considerably stiffer going towards the top because of the part of the crosses that is going up just above the sweet spot, where 2 directions switch. I actually feel it, but may be it's just me? Unfortunately I never could get over that feeling and always end up cutting the string jobs soon after.

    Does skipping one string in the bottom does anything? I don't see why would do much to say the truth... Other than it allows the shorter end to complete the last mains before going all the way up... Do I miss something?

    Now... Talking about the difference in the tensions of the crosses - the one go down vs the one go up. Actually in general, the parts of the string that are closer to the middle of the whole string length vs the parts of the string that are closer to the knot... Here are my thoughts.

    When experimenting with different one string methods I have noticed that on the simple one piece pattern, where you knot the beginning of one main, and the other side of mains goes into the crosses , which than go from most bottom up (even when you start mains in the middle..;)), is that the side that continues into the crosses ends up with time looser than the side with the knot. I even observed some frame deformations because of that.

    You would say the the opposite should be true? The side with the knot should get looser because of the tension lost by the knot? And that is also true. :)

    What happens in my opinion, when the stringing job is new, you would loose a bit of tension at the knots. Depends on the quality of the stringing job but how much in the worse case scenario? Five millimetres, may be a whole centimetre? Ok, I agree! However... Have you ever tried to pre-stretch the string on the door knob? (my guess yes, lol:D, because you are just as crazy as most of us here :D...). You would notice that the string some times stretches decimetres, BG65 would even go half a meter, right? And this is just within the short amount of time you are able to hold it by hand.

    Now imagine the exact middle of the whole string length compared to the string just besides the knot. I would think the string in the middle would get twice softer than at the end, because it absorbed the most stretching from the both sides.

    Could it be just in my head? May be, but I think I have observed it on multiple occasions and the most acute one was in the "beginner's one piece method" as I described above.

    So, to surmise my super long and boring post...:rolleyes:... When doing the bottom crosses first, I find that I am still close to the "perfection" of the 2 piece bottom up style, and also the whole area from the sweet spot going all the way up is absolutely uniform. I really like the felling also... Tight and even, at the same time avoiding knots been close to the mains (and also super neat outside the frame which Haribito is famous for). Perhaps, the only pattern I liked more was Paizhuan but it was too much in the end for me...

    Sorry for the long post... Hope it was at least somewhat understandable... But please ask me to clarify if something was unreadable at all... I find no meter how many times I go through my texts I end up realizing after some time that it is not what I was thinking in my head, with the most horrible grammar mistakes that I missed...:eek:
     
    #17 stradrider, Jun 6, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2020
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  18. s_mair

    s_mair Regular Member

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    I think I could follow most of your chains of thoughts. However, I think you are heavily overthinking the whole issue. I mean, let’s look at it as simple as possible.

    What’s there working part of the string bed? It’s each string between the contract points at the grommets. The tension between these contact points will define how the string bed reacts to an incoming shuttle. And what defines that effective tension of each string is the applied tension and maybe a little the clamping process used. The string doesn’t care where it’s coming from or where it‘s going to next. So in my opinion, it doesn’t matter noticeably in terms of playability (on a fresh job at least) which pattern was used - as long as you keep the other parameters (tension ratio, pre-stretch, clamping process) constant.

    It might(!) be a different story when it comes to long term tension loss, but I’d consider even that to be negligible if everything was done correctly - especially the knots.

    For me personally, choosing a favourite pattern is all about the flow and what feels right. And I just came to love „my“ Haribito variant and I just can’t achieve the same stringing time with a standard Yonex 2-piece.
     
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  19. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    Phew... Glad to hear... I am now looking at my post again and not sure how anyone can manage to get through it :rolleyes:, I probably wouldn't... ;).

    By the way it is the same for me - I love "my Haribito" :) and more efficient at it so that I am a few good minutes faster with it than with the Yonex pattern.

    I agree with you that each string acts as a separate "entity". For the most part, may be like 95%? However it is also a system where every string affects each other. Yes, friction of the grommets reduces it to the minimal amount, however it is not zero.

    Let's say there is zero effect of the strings on each other, than why would a bad knot affect the first string coming from it? There should be the same kind of friction between the knot and the first string as between any other strings? You don't agree?

    I think the tension difference "seeps" through the grommets in between the strings over time. Most of the noticeable effect would probably take during some weeks, because strings stretch quite slowly after the initial settling. But there is this settling period at the beginning, the first couple of days, and this is when I already feel that unevenness above the sweet spot in Haribito Pro where the up and down crosses meet... Is it just in my head? No one else felt it?
     
    #19 stradrider, Jun 7, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2020
  20. stradrider

    stradrider Regular Member

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    Now I want to try try the 50/50 pattern, not sure why I was avoiding it... (I actually know - really hate long strings outside the frame...:)). It is very similar to the way I do my Haribito, just the switch of crosses happens in the middle of the string bed.

    May be I was underestimating when people said 50/50 was really good. I thought it was not a good idea to have up and down crosses switch in the sweet spot. But now I wonder if the reason it feels (and probably ages) so good is that it goes perfectly even from the sweet spot up and down since they are the same distance from the knots... Hmmm...
     

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