The Search For The Ultimate Grip

Discussion in 'Grip' started by cooler, Feb 5, 2001.

  1. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    the wobble and the moi are not the same thing

    what do you mean when you say moi ?
    is it the same as on this page http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/mi.html ?
     
  2. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    I think that the issues of balance are becoming confused now.

    To clarify:

    Adding a grip to the handle DOES affect the "swingweight" -- slightly. This is because, as cooler said:

    • The mass is not concentrated at the fulcrum, but spread over the whole handle. Thus it will affect the moment of inertia, causing a SLIGHT shift of balance towards the handle.
    • There is no exact fulcrum point anyway. This is a simplifying assumption of my model; in fact, the "fulcrum" is the whole area of the hand gripping the racket.

    Nevertheless, we should recognise that adding weight to the handle has a far smaller effect on the swingweight than adding weight to the head.

    I am convinced that my analysis is qualitatively correct. All this can be done without measurement.

    It is not clear, however, whether my analysis is quantitatively correct. Clearly adding weight to the handle has a much smaller effect than adding weight to the head; but what are the numbers? Is it noticeable?

    My subjective experience suggests that adding a grip to the handle affects the swingweight only marginally. I think I can notice a small difference -- but not enough to change my appraisal of the racket's playing characteristics (its "feel").

    In my view, this very slight change in swingweight is not worth worrying about. If you apply more than two layers of replacement grip, then it might start to be more noticeable.
     
    #362 Gollum, Feb 3, 2006
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2006
  3. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    I refer the honourable gentleman to my previous answer :D
    Racquet Swingweight Measurements
     
  4. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    OOOh oooh :eek:

    There are the numbers! And, of course, you could do a similar experiment to see the effect of adding one/two/three layers of replacement grip.

    Nice. Slightly scary, but nice:D
     
  5. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    thx but i already went through that site before i made my prior posts
     
  6. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    thx for providing experimental data that supporing my argument.
    In that Table, it clearly illustrate why less weighted rackets have more MOI than a more heavier racket if u say adding mass always increases MOI? Why some lighter rackets have higher MOI than some heavier racket? Why is two carlton AS1 have large MOI differences when they statically weighted equally?
     
    #366 cooler, Feb 3, 2006
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2006
  7. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    Perhaps plotting the correlation of balance point and MOI would be useful.
     
  8. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    there is no such functional correlation that worth plotting them;) :p
     
  9. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    correction

    ...................................
     
    #369 cooler, Feb 3, 2006
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2006
  10. DinkAlot

    DinkAlot dcbadminton
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    I agree, it's all about the overall feel of the grip. And of course, each person's preference for ideal feel is different. :)
     
  11. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    what's your argument again? Adding weight near the axis reduces MOI?

    here's the list again sorted by MOI with added data about the original weight range the racquets were supposed to be (2U,3U,4U) and what sort of balance they are supposed to be.

    number 1, The Rasmussen Superlite is partly why I did these measurements in the first place. When I first played with it I could barely hit clears 3/4 court. not even close to the back. So I wanted to know what was different about this racquet.

    number 2 looks out of place. Maybe I measured something wrong. maybe Carlton had a bad day at QC.

    next up, 3 and 4, the head-light racquets

    5,6,7,8,9,10 the even 3Us and the head-heavy 4Us
    9 appears to have a large MOI for it's weight, but it's balance point indicates it might be head-heavy rather than even. Why? I don't know. Ask Carlton.
    10 is heavier because it has more (and heavier) grip on it, but it hasn't done much to the MOI

    finally, 11 and 12 the heaviest racquets and the largest MOI


    And the AS1s with the same weight but large MOI difference.
    I added weights to different places on the same racquet.
    weight on the head, much bigger MOI
    weight on the butt, hardly any difference
     

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  12. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    u disputed my statement that ' adding certain mass at certain area/region can reduce MOI' and then went on saying


    your own experiemental data doesnt support your own statement
     
  13. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    which particular piece of data are you talking about?
     
  14. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    i like to reference your table that was originally posted in
    http://www.badmintonforum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=25202

    as highlighted by the circles, your measurement or calculated MOI isnt consistent to your statement that, on similar racket, "then adding weight anywhere can only increase this value(MOI)" does not hold. If your statement was true, how can a heavier racket end up with lower MOI in some cases?
     

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  15. kaizen

    kaizen Regular Member

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    Erm. Sorry to all for this off-topic. Why do most professional players use towel grip? And is it true that the white coloured towel grip is rare in some areas, as in Singapore? Does a towel grip or synthetic grip grip work better? Or are there different advantages for each type? Which is a wiser choice for a competitive player? Or is it up to the player?

    Err. Sorry for too many questions.:p But please help me answer them. Thanks a lot.
     
  16. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    it all come down to personal feel as each of us have different sweat rate and skin texture. Since grips are cheap, it is easy just try different kinds and find out. Most pros use them coz most pros play in SE asia where it is hot and steamy. They practice alot too.
     
  17. kaizen

    kaizen Regular Member

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    I see. Thanks a lot. I'll try out different grips. Previously, I only prefered synthetic grips. I didn't like or was too scared to even try towel grips. Recently I tried a towel grip on my Carlton Airblade Superlite and it felt nice. The racket felt really light, not like when I used synthetic grips on it before which made it slightly heavy. But I don't think I would like towel grips on any 3U or 2U rackets. Oh well, I'll try it out first. Err, sorry. Too much off-topic. See ya.
     
  18. kaizen

    kaizen Regular Member

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    Sweat Absorbing grips BAD???

    Hi to all. I had just just browsed through ebay and this particular guy, selling grips of a brand called Extreme Power, states that sweat-absorbing grips will have a negative effect on the racket handles. He says the sweat will cause the wooden handle to crack. Can anyone check the authenticity of this claim? Is it true?
     
  19. DinkAlot

    DinkAlot dcbadminton
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    Naw, I doubt there will be a significantly negative effect. If a wooden racket handle is exposed to sweat/acid from the hands in copious amounts and over prolonged periods, the handle maybe damaged. However, there's not enough sweat to do that kind of damage. In addition, most racket handles have a protective coating leftover when you remove the original grip. That will minimize sweat seepage.
     
  20. kaizen

    kaizen Regular Member

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    Thanks a lot. Hmmm....Then that guy is just trying to promote his own grips and pull down the reputation of sweat-absorbing grips?!?!?! Jeez.....
     

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