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Discussion in 'Indonesia Professional Players' started by Espírito Santo, Apr 29, 2015.
spot on prediction
What prediction? I said "let's see how they match up". Where are you getting a prediction out of that?
Don't get drawn by petty responses mate, i do think your previous statement was fair & honest. Perhaps things got lost in conversation & translation, what we mean is not well understood & accepted by people coming from different back ground, culture, & nationality. Did i mention nationality ? Some overzealous nationalism can play a factor too. Best regards.
should i laugh or cry?
yesterday is the past today is another battle. it dont really matter who have doubted them, they have nothing to proof. however winning at malaysia will be sweet
new mens double pair formula from China that can be learned by other countries, take 1 experienced succesful player from mens double and pair him with the rising mix double player. Example before was Fu/Zhang and now is Fu/Zheng.
Congratulation to Kevin Sanjaya Sukamuljo/Markus Fernaldi Gideon for their 3rd SS/SSP title in 2017.
They deserve to be No 1, beating all the best MD pairs to get all the titles.
Time to have some rest. I believe, Ko Herry IP will consider to withdraw Kevin/Markus from Singapore Open.
Another SSP/SS throphy for Gideon/Kevin's trophies collection. In 2017, they have won all 3 opening SSP/SS in 2017.
1. All England Open
2. India SS
3. Malaysia SSP
Congratulations to Gideon/Kevin !!!
Who can beat them?
Greatest pair, simply unbeatable when on form.
A level above all.
Congratulations to Marcus Fernaldi Gideon/Kevin Sanjaya Sukamuljo for such an unbelievable run of victories since the start of the All-England SSP 2017!
When I saw the draw for the Malaysia SSP, I thought it will be a super tough route to the title, with an "easy" match only in the opening round against WR18 Takuro Hoki/Yugo Kobayashi.. Subsequently, they had to beat WR23 Liu Cheng/Zhang Nan (who are trying to qualify for the World Championships 2017) in R16, another rematch against the towering WR1 Li Junhui/Liu Yuchen in the QF, took revenge against the pair that last beat them (in December 2016) WR5 Takeshi Kamura/Keigo Sonoda in the SF, and finally took on the unranked new pairing of Fu Haifeng/Zheng Siwei. Fu Haifeng himself is a two-times Olympics Gold Medallist, while Zheng Siwei is another rising star and current WR1 in XD.
I personally thought a QF finish and a defeat against Li/Liu would not be a bad result this week. But the "minions" have proven me and everyone else wrong by clinching their 3rd consecutive titles in 2017 (after the All-England SSP & India SS titles earlier). They are still unbeaten in 2017 and they have already won 6 SS/SSP titles (including 3 SSP titles, with only the home-title Indonesia Open SSP left to win to complete the set of SSP titles). Another 2 GP/GPG titles in Chinese-Taipei & Malaysia Masters, and the SEA Games Team Gold (won in 2015) complete their collection.
Given the current health condition of both players (both are still feeling not well), I would think it is wise for Ko Herry IP (the MD Chief Coach who was with them in All-England and Malaysia SSP) to withdraw them from the upcoming SIngapore Open SS and rest for 2 weeks, before flying off for the Badminton Asia Championships 2017 (Individual Event) at the end of the month.
I also think that the run of wins will stop and I prefer for the defeat to come sooner than later It's better to focus and win on the bigger titles left in 2017. The targets for this year will include:
1. Helping Team INA to at least the SF of the Sudirman Cup 2017 (May)
2. Winning the Indonesia Open SSP 2017 (June)
3. Winning the World Championships 2017 in Glasgow (August)
4. Winning the BWF World Super Series Finals 2017 (December)
If they can win the other SS titles that they have not won (especially European titles), it will be a bonus!
Kevin Sajaya and Marcus has taken over from hendra setiawan and Ahsan as Indonesia as No 1 pair.
For me, I would want them to clear the entire calendar for this year, hahahaha.
Following Ratchanok's back to back to back, I wish them to do "hattrick to hattrick to hattrick"
Quoted from badmintonindonesia.org (the PBSI Official Website):
“Di pertandingan final, Marcus/Kevin dalam kondisi yang sudah capek banget, tetapi motivasinya untuk menang besar sekali. Inilah kunci sukses Marcus/Kevin juara lagi. Dari tenaga, kualitas konsen udah luar biasa,” kata Herry Iman Pierngadi soal laga final di Malaysia Open Super Series Premier 2017.
“Kami sudah berdiskusi dan Marcus/Kevin tetap mau tanding di Singapura. Namun saya tidak membebani mereka target apa-apa di Singapura, mengingat kondisi mereka sudah habis-habisan. Saya rasa dengan tiga gelar berturut-turut adalah capaian yang bagus,” tambah Herry.
Despite the common-sense decision of withdrawing Marcus Fernaldi Gideon/Kevin Sanjaya Sukamuljo from the Singapore SS next week, Herry IP (PBSI's MD Chief Coach) decided to let them play as the pair insisted on playing! Of course, there will be no target whatsoever as the pair is certainly very exhausted at the moment, after 2 consecutive titles and the media frenzy back home after their All-England victory. Even in today's Final match against the Chinese pair, the INA pair was not at their best physical condition (Kevin was nursing a cough and Marcus was not well since yesterday). Yet, the in-form pair wa still very fired up & motivated to win; that was really their key to success behind today's victory!
I personally foresee them probably losing next week: a Korean qualifying pair will possibly face them in R32 (possibly Choi Sol Gyu/Kim Gi Jung or Kim Jae Hwan/Yoo Yeon Seong), followed by either the JPN pair Takuro Hoki/Yugo Kobayaki once again or the HKG pair Tang Chun Man/Or Chin Chung in R16. A defeat against any of these pair will not be surprising to me. It has happened before at the HKG SS where they lost in the first round to Lu Kai/Zheng Siwei, right after they won their first SSP title in China last year.
If they can defend their points next week (QF finish, 5040), another daunting match against the towering Danes Mads Conrad-Petersen/Mads Pieler Kolding will possibly await them. And I dare not foresee beyond QF as I don't think they have the stamina to last that far.
Let's see if the minions can prove me wrong once again.
Yes,I like the review by bad. They have nothing to proof, even when they dont win the india or (and malaysia SSP) they are the best and the most attractive men's double to watch.(that 360 degrees flying backhand smash is kevin signature move) They,the minions are the one revolutionizing mens double with their speed and precision. it's not about power anymore. should i blame fuhaifeng for lifting and for keep telling zhengsiwei to lift(if you watch the match especially live at stadium) i guess no because everyone plays their own way to their advantages. I guess its just too difficult to keep lifting the whole match(for the precision and the easiness for shuttles to go out), otherwise every pair would have beaten them if its that easy and once any pair is behind by a few points its extremely difficult to chase kevin/markus and unwise to lift ( its because keep getting point by lifting is extremely difficult yet for opponent to lose a point its really easy). They can only be beaten a game if opponent takes a huge lead (like the 2nd game for Fu/Zheng or 1st game vs Li/Liu) even then their 2nd game looks ugly yet they only lost 21-14 (with perfect executioning from fu/zheng)
zhengsiwei can play 10 games a week though his XD much seem really easy. nothing is as intense as mens double i would say. I think they can keep playing in singapore, they just need favorable time schedule and probably hopefully a walkover from one of its opponent to fire their motivation. Just dont give them a little bit of spark Like Li/Liu did when 17-14 up 2nd game.
They are like Barcelona with attractive attacking play.
While they're on fire, win as much as they can. Earn money for the pension life, no government will guarantee their life when they are finish. Specially for Marcus who will be 30 soon...
Unless they are win a medal in olympic. They will get pension money for life,Rp 20 million/month for gold, 15 million silver, 10 million bronze. well this program only starting last year let's hope on the future our goverment will still commit in this program
As much as I like watching this pair play and admire the recent success they have had, I don't think they are "unbeatable".
Without taking anything away from Gideon/Sukamuljo, their rising does come at at time when a lot of the strongest pairings in MD have either disbanded or retired at around the same time. China and particularly Korea are clearly lacking in outstanding talent in the MD camp, Malaysia and Denmark are too but at least they have some strong pairings. But none of them currently have anyone that I would call "outstanding".
I would have loved to see an on form FHF/ZN or LYD/YYS, Endo/Hayakawa play against Gideon/Sukamuljo or even their compatriots Setiawan/Ahsan.
And when these guys were still playing/playing together, there wasn't as much attention on Gideon/Sukamuljo. So coaches were probably concentrating their efforts on beating other pairings. Given the way Fu&Zheng played in G2, it was obvious the coaches are starting to pick up on ways to beat Gideon/Sukamuljo. I think all coaches will have by now studied the way Gideon/Sukamuljo play and noted their weaknesses. I have always felt that the modern Indonesian style of playing doesn't lend itself well to consistency and longevity at the top as it is very much form and mood dependant and generally involves higher risk shots but we shall wait and see with this pairing!
It's a shame that apart from Kamura/Sonoda there aren't many others that are strong and consistent in the flat play/defensive situation. Otherwise it would make for very interesting matches.
The Chinese tactic of lifting full and high to the baseline seems to be not quite working out, I see FHF doing the complete full lifts in the hope that Gid/Kev will muck it up, but they did have some answers for that at the moment. And I'm surprised Zheng SW failed to return a baseline smash from Kevin at the baseline. Means ZSW's defense isn't as good, or just nerves.
In XD, he simply tries to work himself out of trouble if he is in one and let the mushroom headed half-male/half-female morphed partner set it up and rampage the opposing pair's lady, cross court ram/smash/drive to the lady at all costs and while it works, MD is different in that aspect. Sure he wins some points in MD with his cross court drives, but he doesn't really do much in terms of setups for FHF IMO.
Really, sports is a time for opportunistic entries, enter at the right time, win win win. Otherwise, get covered in the crowd of talents in the sea. Much like how Mercedes AMG F1 has a dominant car in a 4 year period with a change of formula, the level of MD in world badminton has suddenly fell or adjusted if you will, with people aging and retiring, to a point that people who happen to be STILL active thrives and shines through. It's more like a chapter closing/opening and era shift, more than anything.
That IMO is why LCW and LD is very much applauded as the greatest few as they managed to keep that standard for so long, as they started out from the 15 point era to the current 21, who knows, maybe they might enter and see the 11 points system.
Say I'm now 15. LCW is 34 going 35. There definitely is a space for me to pick up down the road, maybe from 5 years later till I'm 33. But if I'm now 28-29, the end of the tunnel is much nearer and I will never ever have a chance at consistently shining because there are the "old guards" still excelling in the profession for at least 1-2 years more. Timing is the key here.
And of course, your skills mature and improve, along with oldies going off the boil, it's your time. How long, is anyone's guess, and their hard work.
Haha. the mushroom headed half-male half-female & probably a fake ager.
That is why its all about opportunities. Does it matter if kevin&markus is beatable or unbeatable? why matter so much? that is the reason why many opponents lost to them - thinking too much of whether they are beatable or not beatable. Just play the game and enjoy. if you play well then you will be able to beat them.
LYD/YYS is probably the best pair around before the olympics but they ended with no world championship but i think they are still the best pair (it doesnt mean without WC titles they are not the best) . It's all tradeoff. and Ahsan/Hendra gave them the most problem and won 2 WC (and asian games ) and 2nd to them in superseries titles. It was nerve, the same with LYD defeat in RIOolympic.
Now is the new era, no point comparing. Would LYD/YYS be better than Ricky/Rexy?
For now, we are just enjoying this new style of play that is not slow and boring. Its like so cool, in the past 170cm guys can never be so good in mens double but now its changing.I also realised LYD play an extremely slow points taking super long break after each point. Great but boring.
and its true everyone need opportunities.
Those MS in china and malaysia dont get much opportunities..thats why it just belong to one or two guys and it kinda get boring I really glad that hendra setiawan left the national team. With this, kevin/gideon can and have the 'opportunity' to rise. I dont think it will be boring in MD because of fast paced its easy to create upsets so the lesson is with opportunities, everything is beautiful at its time. although the minions juggernaut keep rolling. 6 SS titles, catch them if they can