Do you think African American will dominate Badminton if they tried?

Discussion in 'General Forum' started by SSSSNT, Jun 29, 2021.

  1. SSSSNT

    SSSSNT Regular Member

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    I had a conversation the other day about Asia's dominance in Badminton and someone half jokingly said "wait till black people played this game, it's over for us". Although it's only a joke, I watch the NBA and how the black players there are so much much much more athletic and explosive than in any Asian basketball league. Even in their lower leagues like high school or even at recreational basketball, the black kids are so much more explosive and athletic. These are traits that I feel bodes very well for Badminton because a lot of badminton is about short bursts of explosiveness.
     
  2. SnowWhite

    SnowWhite Regular Member

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    Badminton is a very technical sport. It's not a direct measurement of physical capacity like it is for a marathon for example, or a sprint. It is not always the fittest person on court who wins the match. Badminton requires very fine precise movements compared to other sports. To refine these movements, to push them to the limit of perfection, you need other players to train with and to push you to those limits. That's why, despite some outliers, the countries with large player pools produce world class players.

    If a genetically perfect super talent was born in a country that doesn't have that player pool, they will probably not make it to the top.
     
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  3. SSSSNT

    SSSSNT Regular Member

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    Well that's the case for almost all sports though. Sports here refer to tennis, soccer, crickets, football, etc. Not marathon or sprints.

    Of course 'if they tried' means they would undergo training overseas with all the best talents. Maybe sponsored by Asian or European badminton club owners from a young age and later offered citizenship since US allows dual citizenship. Basketball clubs has done that, bring the 'black rejects' (not good enough to play basketball in the US) to play for their clubs.
     
  4. Budi

    Budi Regular Member

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    agree with this. Earth we step on & sky above us are our limit. When we play on small club lv, we might be the best among the club & considered a god. But when we step in to national tournament its different story, not to mention a world tournament.... We would feel so small & the gap feel so big.

    So could they dominate? There is possibility, nothing impossible. But for now, its not.
     
  5. vntmzn

    vntmzn Regular Member

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    i don't think one race is superior in sport. why black people dominate nba, is as simple as basketball is played more frequent among black people compare to white or asian people in their daily life. it becomes their lifestyle. if you put enough effort, passion, lifestyle on one sport, you will dominate no matter who you are.
     
  6. deepinthemusic

    deepinthemusic Regular Member

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    If only physical ability is the only reason one can win this game, hendra/ahsan should not be world no.2 right now
     
  7. SSSSNT

    SSSSNT Regular Member

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    That sounds nice and reasonable but definitely not reality though. The number of asians and white people who played basketball vastly outnumbers black people. It's been well researched that black people just have a much better athleticism and explosiveness in general. Now, obviously they still need effort, brain and passion, but when you have that raw physical talent, you can reach a much higher level.
     
  8. Budi

    Budi Regular Member

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    I think its not about number of black or white but more of personal environtment.

    As kids we dont know anything about sport & i just play classic games with friend. Hide & seek, etc.... Running around like crazy.
    At school i learn about basketball, play it with friend & good at it.
    At college my environtment are more on badminton, so i master it up till now.

    Also like i said, the earth we step on & the sky above us are our limit. When i play with my social friend, i feel so great labeled as god being the best in the group. But thats my limit when i just stay in those club, i grow no more as no one can give me enough challange even tho im far far & far away from perfection. Then when i play outside my club, thats when i feel so little & i start growing again. Then i join my company club & then become representative for company tournament.

    So i think why black people are good at basketball coz they had a strong good competitive tournament. The brand also strong there so you can make a living just becoming pro basketball player. Really doubt they can make a living becoming a pro badminton player there. & the opposite for us asians. But if the black people come living here in asian or we asian live there, there is no doubt black can become pro badminton or we asian can become pro basketball player.
     
  9. SSSSNT

    SSSSNT Regular Member

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    It's very naive if we think physical advantage doesn't play a huge part in top level basketball. Even millions of asians living there wouldn't change the fact that asians in general have a huge physical disadvantage and still won't become pro basketball player except maybe a few people.
     
  10. Budi

    Budi Regular Member

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    Life will find its own way. (A nice quot from Jurrasic Movie:D)
    we human had the ability to adapt & evolve.
    When one had an advantage, it also come with disadvantage. Yes basketball player are big gigantic strong player yet i know few little small asian guy who play profesionally with them. They are phisically weaker but quite agile & slippery & thats their advantage. Yes it just maybe 1 out of billion but again thats due to the environtment.
    Then again in badminton that require quick reaction & fast movement, those huge size will catch alot more gravity, they would have issue doing rapid & quick movement. But again maybe they would be able to find their style that no one ever see that could fit their physical form. So nothing imposible.
     
  11. SSSSNT

    SSSSNT Regular Member

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    That's pretty naive thinking. The advantage is not size or strength.
     
  12. SnowWhite

    SnowWhite Regular Member

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    The genetic advantage in explosiveness only applies to west Africans and their descendants in the America's. Here in England, and I think to a lesser extent on the European continent, more black people are from north african or east african descent. Therefore the view that black people are better at sports is generally an American one. Especially since the sports more popular in Europe have a more even distribution of races.

    It is hard to say what the perfect build for a badminton player is since there exists a wide range at the top level (think axelsen / ginting). But there is also a wide range of playing styles, some more explosive, others more conservative. Even if someone has the body with the best possible potential for badminton (whatever that may be), in the grander picture of what makes someone a world class player, it plays only a very minor role, and certainly not a determining one.

    You're probably right in identifying the great potential for black americans and west africans in badminton, but this potential is ultimately unimportant 1. because they will never mobilize as a group in pursuit of world class badminton and 2. because a slight genetic advantage in physical potential plays a minor role in the road to becoming a world class badminton player.
     
  13. Smash the net

    Smash the net Regular Member

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    I think their explosiveness will be no different from the current top badminton players.
     
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  14. Budi

    Budi Regular Member

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    its not about size only. It just small example.
    If we talk about their super advantage, i say its quite a dumb they didnt own the games. How can be? They had all the advantage yet they didnt own the game up till now.
    But its not fair to say so coz, again its their environtment that makes them that way. Put them in the right environtment, anyone/any race/any gender would have a chance to become a pro on any branch of sport/science/anything.
    No one is perfect & one advantage also come with disadvantage to. Minions own the MD games for quite awhile, showing insane godly speed from Kevin. But human evolve & always find a way to solve their problem. So that what the JP player did & beat down the god.
     
  15. SSSSNT

    SSSSNT Regular Member

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    Correct. Which is why the title says "African American".

    It's not a minor advantage though. There's huge difference in athleticism and explosiveness. You mentioned Axelsen and Ginting. Think of someone like Axelsen who's faster/quicker than Ginting then we're getting close to their potential. The whole premise is about potential and the what if they are given the same training as others. If someone ask, hey what if Usain Bolt plays football. You don't answer, well that's unimportant because he'll never play football. That shows lack of understanding on the premise.
     
  16. SnowWhite

    SnowWhite Regular Member

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    .

    I missed that specification in the title, sorry about that.

    About the 'huge difference': maybe it is semantics, and I may be wrong, but you seem to believe there is a 'huge' difference in explosiveness between races. I think a tiny edge in the average explosiveness of the group means that a higher percentage of that group reaches the top level (compared to other races), which leads to an overrepresentation of black americans at the top level where every tiny advantage contributes.


    Someone like Axelsen who is faster than Ginting is getting close to the potential of african americans?

    It is physically impossible for someone with the build of Axelsen to be faster than Ginting. This is beyond race. Axelsen's height gives him more reach, but his body is heavier and his limbs are longer, and therefore more difficult to move. No amount of extra muscle, higher fast-twitch-ratio, or explosive potential is going to negate these drawbacks of a taller build. If you compare his movement to most other top players it looks pretty wooden, but there isn't much more he can do about it with the body he has. It's quite impressive how agile Axelsen still manages to be despite his build.

    I know in basketball, the athletes all move very fluidly and smooth, so it is easy to make the mistake of thinking that they would do much better than Axelsen. But movement in badminton is different from movement in basketball. In badminton it is more common than in basketball to have to completely reverse your momentum, whereas in basketball, it is more possible to preserve momentum at least partially. The former favors smaller lighter players, whereas the latter favors taller players. In badminton, anyone with a similar build to Axelsen, regardless of race, wouldn't move much more fluidly than Axelsen, and never in a million years approach the fluidity of Ginting. (Of course smaller players have other challenges to overcome).


    Finally, I remember acknowledging in my previous post that there is probably great potential for black americans and west africans in badminton. Or to put that in simpler words: they probably could if they tried.
     
    #16 SnowWhite, Jul 13, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2021
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  17. CzechKronner

    CzechKronner Regular Member

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