Disappointing Order of Play

Discussion in 'Sudirman Cup 2007' started by cooler, Jun 17, 2007.

  1. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    China coach takes issue over Sudirman Cup order rumpus
    Sun Jun 17, 1:34 PM ET


    Chinese coach Li Yongbo criticised the eleventh hour attempt by the Badminton World Federation to rejig the order of play in the Sudirman Cup final which his team won here Sunday.

    China raced off with their sixth final beating Indonesia 3-0 to rob spectators of the showdown between world champion Lin Dan and Olympic champion Taufik Hidayat, one of two 'dead' rubbers.

    In the draw on Saturday night, the order was pulled out of a hat - a change to previous years - and the men's singles came out last. With China winning the first three rubbers, it meant that the last two did not need to be played.

    Early Sunday championship director and the chief executive of Badminton Scotland, Anne Smillie, arranged a meeting between tournament referee Keith Hawthorne and the two team coaches to try and arrange a change the order.

    But Li would not budge.

    "It was most unfortunate," said Smillie, who could otherwise reflect on a hugely successful week.

    'The draw was made late on Saturday night and I realise it would have been extremely difficult to change it on Sunday morning and maybe upset the players' mental state and their preparation for such an important match.

    "But it was very disappointing. It was a fist class show and it would have been brilliant for the spectators and the TV audience if there had been a different order of play. It was the only hiccup, but one that mattered a great deal."

    But Li said he was also angered. 'I am not happy either," he said. "I don't think the BWF has shown any respect to the players or coaches. The casual attitude about draws is not very good."

    Hawthorne also realized he had made a mistake. "On hindsight, we shouldn't have done it," he said.

    'I have apologised to Anne Smillie and Badminton Scotland."

    Previously, the order of play was decided between the two team managers - this time it was changed and pulled out of a hat from the semi-final stage.

    But the schedule apart, Li was pleased with his team's display but critical of Lin, who had lost China's only rubber of the week, losing to Malaysia's Lee Chong Wie in the group matches.

    "The mixed doubles and men's doubles were particularly pleasing and everything is shaping up well for the Olympics in Beijing next year," he said.

    "But there was disappointment in Lin's performance.

    "He should learn from the men's doubles. They showed spirit and determination. He has done that in the past, but not this week."
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------]

    Sudirman Cup final order of play arouses controversies

    The play order of the badminton Sudirman Cup final on Sunday remained unchanged despite a proposal of having men's singles played earlier.

    Official at the tournament were trying to put the most eye-catching men's singles in first three rubbers, which was down at bottom of the five sets as was decided by draw the previous night, due to worries that it won't be played at all if hot favorites China beat Indonesia 3-0 or 3-1.

    Officials from the world governing body BWF phoned the Chinese team hours before the kickoff of the final on Sunday but China refused to accept any change, according to a Chinese coach.

    Sudirman Cup media officer William Kings told Xinhua that some broadcasters were eager to have pictures of the anticipated clash between Chinese world number one Lin Dan and his archrival Olympic champion Taufik Hidayat.

    "They went crazy when they're aware that there might not be a men's singles at all," he said, "Everyone wants to see that. It's a real exciting part of the tournament."

    Indonesia are making their seventh appearance in the final although they only won the tournament once in the 1989 inaugural edition.

    Five-time winners China, chasing their sixth Sudirman trophy in Glasgow, beat Indonesia in the 2005 final in Beijing.

    Source: Xinhua
    -----------------------------------------------------------


    I think in this sudirman, lin dan isn't in form. However, i doubt taufik would go all out anyway since he knows he would be playing for a lost cause once INA lost the XD. So if LD vs TH match was selected to play, both won't be playing at their best.
     
  2. abedeng

    abedeng Regular Member

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    MAS is more of a "growing up lesson" for MD, WD, WS (Anita) and XD.

    About the new tournament rule change using draws to determine matches from semis onwards, most coaches including LYB (and us obviously) wasn't happy with the change. But once the draw was made, LYB wasn't going to agree to changes, else why have the rule change in the first place.

    For once I agree with LYB, though I still miss LD vs Taufik.
     
  3. pjswift

    pjswift Regular Member

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    Beg to differ. I thought LYB was against the LCW vs LD match being played last, claiming LD will be demotivated? But with the LD vs TH match being scheduled last, LD will not be similarly demotivated? Is LYB a coward?
    The rule needs to be changed and order of play fixed like:
    XD,MS,WS,MD,WD. This will automatically take care of problems where players are in 2 events.
    Otherwise all matches should be played. 3-0 is misleading. The real score is likely to be 4-1 if the MS match had been played.
    Is this the first SC where the talk is how well run and how it has been a success but years later fans will remember being cheated of their star match? To me, this SC is like throwing a big party but the star did not show up.
    BWF,mistakes happen. Idiocy is when mistakes are repeated. Intelligence is when mistakes are corrected and not allowed to happen again. Show us which 'I' represents you.
    Frankly ,I'm adsolutely disgusted because this makes Badminton look so stupid.
     
  4. V3i HoN6

    V3i HoN6 Regular Member

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    I think is better to fixed up the order and play according to it.
    Those who play in two double will have to take the consequence of making the decision.
    Otherwise, any match after the winning match will be discredited.
    Seriously if they continue playing last night, and somehow TH beat LD, there will be like 50 pages of arguing whether LD being relax and what not.

    We can see that in LCW vs LD game.
     
  5. robin7

    robin7 Regular Member

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    Hot favourite China comfortably retained their Sudirman Cup world mixed team championship title yesterday by beating Asian rivals Indonesia 3-0.

    It was a repeat of the score line in 2005 when the biennial event was last contested and the sixth triumph for the Chinese in the 10 editions of the event since 1989.

    But the final was surrounded by controversy over the sidelining of the standout clash between world number one Lin Dan and Indonesia's Olympic champion Taufik Hidayat.

    China's mixed doubles pair of Zheng Bo and Gao Ling battled past Limpele Flandy and Vita Marissa 19-21, 21-17, 21-19 and the men's duo of Cai Yun and Fu Haifeng made it 2-0 when they beat Markis Kido and Candra Wijaya 21-11, 21-13.

    Olympic women's singles champion Zhang Ning sealed the title with a 21-16, 21-9 success over world-ranked 44 Adriyanti Firdasari.

    The 3-0 score line meant there was no need to play the women's doubles and the concluding men's singles, which would have featured a contest between world champion Lin Dan and Taufik Hidayat.

    With China widely expected to win 3-0, making the last two matches redundant, officials tried hard yesterday morning to amend the situation.

    But no agreement could be reached and the original order stood, to the disappointment of the 2,000 capacity crowd and anger from television stations.

    Championship director Anne Smillie said: “No one is more disappointed than me. We have put on a first-class show and the final leg of this first-class performance would have been brilliant had we seen a different order of play. The crowd and television networks round the world will be disappointed but it was impossible for us on this occasion to have the order of play altered.”

    Indonesia was making their seventh appearance in the final but has won only once, in 1989. China was in the final for the seventh time in succession.
     

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  6. hcyong

    hcyong Regular Member

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    You should mention the source of the article. It's from The Star Online (June 18, 2007).

    My suspicion is that CHN is not interested in the MS being played. Therefore LYB preferred it to be the last match. The tournament director wanted it to be played, but CHN was insistent. I don't know about INA's stand.

    When the team managers submit their lineup, they also submit their preferred match order. If the managers have no agreement on the lineup, I guess a draw will be made.

    Some of the forummers blamed the tournament referee/director for this without knowing the procedures. I am still not certain of the exact procedure but this article sheds a bit of light on it.
     
  7. abedeng

    abedeng Regular Member

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    They had this stupid rule whereby order of play is determined by draw. So the 5 matches are drawn one by one from a box, MS happened to be last.

    Previously, each team manager can suggest an order of play, and the finalized one will be determined based on whether a team has players who play more than one match, so that the player can have sufficient rest in between matches.
     
  8. jimbo

    jimbo Regular Member

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    what? u cant be serious...!!! the sequence of the matches were chosen by random pick? :eek: pls tell the officials that this is not TOTO :D

    I can understand if a lady plays in both XD and WD, but which team (Div1) has a guy playing both MS and MD? I strongly believe that (due to popular demand), MS should always play as the following sequence:
    XD - MS - WS - MD - WD

    Still dissapointed with the officials :mad:
     
  9. volcom

    volcom Regular Member

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    Lin Dan doesn't look too happy
     
  10. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    i have merged in a couple of news article that cooler posted in another thread.

    if they are to be trusted, then it is the tournament director/organizer who originally decided on the order of play by "drawing out of a hat". and then later on they figure out that randomness is not very smart and tried to change the ordering a couple of hours before the match starts.

    i don't blame LYB for not allowing the change, players have been mentally prepared for their play order and trying to change things a couple of hours can potentially affect their preparation.
     
  11. hcyong

    hcyong Regular Member

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    I wrote my comments above before reading the FINALS thread. I didn't know they changed the rules for the semifinals onwards. IMHO, they should let the team managers decide on the order and only if there is disagreement, should they draw from the hat.
     
  12. hcyong

    hcyong Regular Member

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    However, I still think that LYB did not want Lin Dan to play and was therefore secretly happy with the draw.
     
  13. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    i think he definitely has that in mind also, but it too was convenient for him as the hat draw just came out to his favor. sometimes some ppl just have all the luck.
     
  14. samuel882

    samuel882 Regular Member

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    I fink thats enough for the order of play of SC here...

    No matter how many opinions v voice out here.. BWF(IBF??) wont listened to us ....
     
  15. hcyong

    hcyong Regular Member

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    I agree that their decision to randomly pick the order is not the best.

    However, they also cannot fix the match order anyhow they want. How do you define "popular demand" BTW? I still think it is best to let the team managers (with mediators and certain guidelines) sort out the match order. Should there still be a disagreement, then the matches not in agreement will tbe drawn.
     
  16. robin7

    robin7 Regular Member

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    Oops...I forgot to mention the source (Star Online dated June 18, 2007).
     
  17. Angelou

    Angelou Regular Member

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    My Opinion

    I too have no complaints about li yong bo's decision a few reasons. Li Yong Bo may wish to maintain the mentality of the Chinese team. They are here to win. Not to provide excitement to the spectators. Even though spectators are the reason that world badminton exists. If LYB did allow this change, it may encourage "slacker" behavior. He wishes that his players maintain their professional attitudes and so LYB retains his form and stands as an example. Exactly what leaders do. Though many people would argue that LYB is a jerk and is pummeling badminton into the gutter. But he's just acting in the best interest for the Chinese Team,(in his opinion). Plus LYB and the chinese team work D@MN HARD. I heard that many players in the Chinese national Team quit because of the hard work and training. I think Gong Zhi Chao is an example. I also think that Xie Xing Fang mentioned it in her interview. And so, it's really tough. People are tired of the Chinese winning on a consistent basis, and when they lose everybody jumps up in delight, which would probably really piss the Chinese off. Because no one jumps when they win (except china), but everybody flies when they lose (except China). And lastly, the draw out of hat thing is so g@y. I mean their original plans were better, where the managers decided the order of play. But correct me if I'm wrong, I don't have much knowledge about how the order of play works.

    On a different Note, I think Lin Dan needs a break. He's been winning so much that it's probably gotten to his head. (Sort of like taufik). Maybe a bit of down time, so that he may rejuvenate may restore that motivation he lost.
     
    #17 Angelou, Jun 17, 2007
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2007
  18. abedeng

    abedeng Regular Member

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    Angelou, put that way, I would agree with LYB's logic, if not all his decisions. Already I missed having LCW vs Gade, there was not going to be a LD vs Taufik too .....

    But I don't think LD needs a break, he just needs to find his form back after injury. A player such as him does not normally let success get to his head, he has LYB to smack him .....
     
  19. jimbo

    jimbo Regular Member

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    Yes, I doubt it would happen to LD. Unlike Taufik, LD has LYB over his shoulder to watch him closely. LYB is the 'almighty' in CHN camp and no way LD could do wat Taufik did (refused to compete at All England 07)
     
  20. Joyous

    Joyous Regular Member

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    [/I]

    LYB may seemed dictorial but I think this abstract of article from correspondent Jan of Badzine is an eye-opener :-

    I’m not happy at all with what I’m seeing in Lin Dan now. In fact, I would like to see Lin Dan returning to his old self where he is extremely confident, driven and aggressive with an attitude. To me, that is the making of a true champion. No athlete can think of becoming a champion if he wants to be just a friendly ambassador”, said Li who hinted the possibility of dropping the world number 1 in tomorrow’s finals line-up.

    It doesn’t matter to me if the world number 1 doesn’t play in the finals and the possible controversy that would surround the decision. What is most important to me is selecting the player that will be the best representative of the Spirit of the Chinese team. The player must want to win and want to win it badly. Lin Dan has failed to convince me so far.

    But I always believe in respecting my players’ wishes and Lin Dan is very respected by his teammates too. So I will have a chat with Lin Dan about his performance today and he needs to convince me and his teammates that he is worth our trust and confidence in him, otherwise I can take the liberty to drop him”, said an indignant Li.


    Based on the above, I think LYB is level headed and firm. The player can be a favorite but in a team event, team spirit is of paramount importance.
     

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