Deceptive strokes

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by sharpmindx, Aug 10, 2006.

  1. sharpmindx

    sharpmindx Regular Member

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    Does anyone know any training for developing deceptive strokes? Played with some guys recently and though they were older, their strokes were all deceptive. I reckon it is all wrist work but i could not see clearly what they were doing. Also, i believe to counter deceptive players , u need to wait for them to strike the shuttle before u move as they will place shuttle to the opposite direction where u are moving toward. Therefore, throwing u off balance.
     
  2. Mads "U"

    Mads "U" Regular Member

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    Avoid or Exploit ?

    There are different ways of dealing with players using deceptive strokes.
    1: To wait. (as you guessed)
    If your opponent waits for you to move before performing the stroke, then the longer you can wait before you move, the lower the shuttle will drop. They will end up having to play the shuttle upwards instead of downwards. This gives you much more time to reach the shot, especially at the net.
    2: Park them on the baseline.
    Deceptive strokes are most effective from the net. Deceptive strokes from the baseline lose much of the effect since the receiver has much more time to adapt.
    3: Pull back.
    When your opponent in doubles use disguised returns, their best returns usually are shots, where they initiate a drop and then at the last momente push the shuttle to the left or right rear corner. Or they initiate a push to one rear corner and turns it to the other.
    Common for most of these deceptive returns is that they usually end up in one of the rear corners.
    So position yourself a little further back than usual, and it will be easier to reach these deceptive returns.
    4: Speed up.
    The faster you play, the less time they will have to prepare their deceptive shots.

    5: Keep them away from their best shots. If they make their best shots at the net, keep them on the baseline, and vice versa.

    6: (this is the most fun!) Turn their best shot against them.
    Using approach 5: - Speed - you may notice that shots are not decided from what you actually see in the actual rally. There simply is not time for that. Which shot you choose is based on your own possibilities, and your perception of where your opponent is going to be. Based on where he/she was the last time, or where people are generally going to be in a normal game.
    The more you are under pressure (fast play, tired or nerves), the more limited your choices are going to be. AND the more likely you will be to choose your “best shot”. Your arm will start doing the stroke, even if your eye tells you that it is not going to be a good idea. If you can identify the rally patterns which leads to your opponents “best stroke”, you can either avoid these patterns OR use them to be able to predict what he/she is going to do next.

    Even the very best of shots are useless, if the opponent is just standing there waiting for them!

    This is fun! Especially when you can repeat the same rally pattern, and make your opponent lose points with his/her “Best Shot” over and over again.

    It is usually a good way of breaking the spirit of the other side.
    “How could I win this game, if I can’t even win a single rally with my best shot?”

    Have fun.
     
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  3. sharpmindx

    sharpmindx Regular Member

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    thanks

    That's what i thot too. Thot it will be a good idea to share with the rest of the players. I totally agree with ur strategy. Plus all the deceptive shots are in front of the court as we were playing double.
    Plenty of way to skin the cat. I watch Lee Chong Wei played Lin Dan a few times. LCW definitely is more deceptive and caught LD wrongfooted
     
  4. taneepak

    taneepak Regular Member

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    Deception hobbles your opponent's anticipation and keep him or her on tenterhooks. Only opponents with very fast reaction, not anticipation, can handle deceptive players, AOTBE.
     
  5. llpjlau

    llpjlau Regular Member

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    learning the shots

    how do you actually learn the deceptive shots? it takes creativity? also in the game i would feel too pressured to actually use the shots. how do i overcome that?
     
  6. jerby

    jerby Regular Member

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    get convidence:p

    as for 'learning' deception...try copying the shots that catch you off guard...
    The most important thing in deception is the stroke rythm.

    To quote LYB:
    There are 3 phase in a deceptive stroke. a very clear preperation phase, a pullback, and a fast stroke (where you hit the shuttle).

    example: come to the net with your racket high (phase 1), lower your racket (2) and then hit the shuttle quickly (3).
    possible options: come in high, fake a netdrop (phase 2) and do a fast lob. Or fake a straight lob, and do a cross. endless possibilities.

    as for rear-court deception: just cycle thorugh all stroke phases (hip-rotation, shoulder rotation, etc) but when the final wrist movement shoudl go wait for a fraction of a second. this minor delay might cause your opponent to lose track of your stroke. then, in the last movement of the wrist choose to do eitehr a straight shot or cross. or a clear/drop/smash.
    Ultimate deception in the rearcourt is when the opponent can't gues what shot or were you are going to hit until you've hit it. Or when they jump the gun and wlak into the wrong corner...

    don't practise the fancy lookign shots. deception is more about timing and court awareness (were are you/ where is your opponent) than weird shots from impossible places..

    as for 'countering' deception just get used to it. against such players you cán't move before they've hit. or , if possible, pace it up...no more slow drops/clear...
     
  7. robc06

    robc06 Regular Member

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    Practice. its that simple, to be able to use a deceptive stroke you need to practice. I am practicing two different deceptive strokes, both are used at the net, and it takes a lot of practice. Im not confident or consistant enough yet.

    Also its better to confident to be able to play standard shots and have good foot work before you start looking at deceptive strokes.

    As good as they are they wont win games for you. And you shouldnt use deceptive shots all the time, maybe every now and then.
     
  8. malayali

    malayali Regular Member

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    One of the ways to effectively counter 'deceptive' players is to play a little more faster. the more you slow down the game it is even better for the deceptive players...
     
  9. drop_n_net

    drop_n_net Regular Member

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    well, u can also be deceptive in a more "passive" way. it doesnt always have to be making ur opponent think ur doing one move while u do another. u can make all of your strokes look the same, especially at the rearcourt. i think this is a better type of deception, because with the other one, your opponent can eventually guess what your doing, and second, its better when ur in a quicker rally, bacause you no longer need the time to think about deception anymore. Just do whatever you were going to do, and your opponent has to wait for you to hit the bird before they can even move.
     
  10. Ranmira

    Ranmira Regular Member

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    No wonder I have tons of problems against them, :p. Which would have better results from your experiences to to avoid playing against deceptive strokes -- train to decrease reaction time, or increase the pace of the rally?
     
  11. Monster

    Monster Regular Member

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    Deception shots are least effective on people who are super fast and very efficient braking system!
     
  12. taneepak

    taneepak Regular Member

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    The better deceptive players have a strong all-round game. Weaker players who rely on deception most of the time are not half as devastating. Increasing the pace of the rally against a deceptive player will not make any difference. The best strategy is to avoid second-guessing a deceptive player's stroke. It is best to play each shot on its merits.
    Deceptive players have very high hand/wrist speed because they take or hit the shuttle at a higher speed. The wrist plays a very important role here, as deception is obtained by full use of the wonderful unversal joint of the wrist. A last second turn of it will send the shuttle to the opposite side of the court from that apparently originally intended.
    To preserve the possibility of deception , remember that the wrist should be cocked back for all strokes no matter whether great power is needed or not. Wrist speed is a speed added to arm speed, an extra. When to uncock the wrist is critical. The wrist should be uncocked only in the last two feet before the racquet strikes the shuttle. In this way the wrist gives extra impetus to the racquet head; obviously, the faster the latter moves, the harder the shuttle is hit. The fact that the wrist is brought into play only at the very last part of the swing, is a vital factor in deception for in the last split second we can add or, by letting the wrist loiter, subtract speed from our intended shot, as well as change the shuttle's direction by simultaneously rotating the wrist.
     
  13. butch20

    butch20 New Member

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    i can confidently say that i am able to execute some deceptive shots.. but consider that i've been playing for about 6 years already..

    for me, to be able to execute a deceptive shot what you need to have are:

    1. control of the racket- your wrist change when you change your shot should be able to still make the racket face hit the ball squarely

    2. good timing- in executing deceptive shots, you are actually almost cradling the shuttle while in flight, deciding on which shot to make after the opponent has moved.. therefore, you should know the speed of the ball and how much time is left for you to still make the shots you are to choose from

    3. trained vision- this is to see the position of the opponents on the other side of the net. if you are playing doubles, you should be able to see the one charging to your shot and the relative position of his partner while at the same time keeping your racket cocked to hit the shuttle

    4. quick recovery- making the shot is not the end of it, you should recover still to be prepared for the return shot when they do so.
     
  14. BethuneGuy

    BethuneGuy Regular Member

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    I think somebody mentioned this already. But if you play very fast, and take the shuttle as high as you can at the net, the opponent can't do anything but wait. Keep an eye on his feet using your peripheral vision, and if he stutters/moves before you hit, flick it. I think this type of deception is the best kind, for shots where you wait at the net, gives your opponent more time to recover, and if he's good, you're just killing yourself.
     
  15. taneepak

    taneepak Regular Member

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    Deception is usually the asset of a skilful player who has mastered the fundamentals of stroke-making and footwork. No matter how deceptive you are, if you are unable to hit a shuttle from baseline to baseline when forced back, your deception is useless. Deception requires a higher level of skill, although it can be achieved by an average player who has achieved a respectable level of competency in his technique. Also, deception lies in the wrist. If you don't use your wrist then there can be no deception. Non-wrist hand and arm movements cannot have much disguise because you can read them a mile away. You need to have perfect timing in uncocking of your wrist, a very fast wrist snap, and a strong wrist.
    The ex-Chinese player Zhao Jianhua is a classic case of a deceptive player at its best.
     
  16. vip_m

    vip_m Regular Member

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    Deception technique instruction available for free

    We've made the addendum (which covers deception at the net) to the book "Advanced Badminton Techniques" free! You can download it now at...

    http://instructoons.com/book/

    It'll give you great instruction on how to do deceptive shots the same way elite players do it.
     
  17. taneepak

    taneepak Regular Member

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    At the net you have 5 choices to play the shot-tumble the shuttle, tap, cross, push or lift. You must use the same stroke action for all the 5 choices of net play, and all 5 net strokes should be executed with appropriate leverage like drawing circles for any deception. You must also approach the net with your dominant right foot, to better improve your reach and to reach the shuttle better balanced to play the shot. You must also extend and put your racquet up when going for the net shot, then pull it back and draw a circle before playing the net shot.
    Generally there are 3 broad categories of deception-variation of the racquet swing, variation of your court movements, and varying the angle of contact with your racquet. But all these require the wrist. Without the wrist there can be no deception.
     
  18. drop_n_net

    drop_n_net Regular Member

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    well, the drawing circles, you're refering to the forehand net shot right? it feels weirder with the backhand net side.
     
  19. Monster

    Monster Regular Member

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    drop: i've seen ppl doing the drawing circles forehand net shot u talked about. damn... i can't do it !
     
  20. taneepak

    taneepak Regular Member

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    Actually you should draw a circle for all shots, not only net shots. The reason is to to get leverage because a circle-another name is swing-is your power engine which makes it possible for your forearm (rotation, otherwise known as pronation and supination) and wrist, to deliver those punchy shots.
    It is easier to draw a circle for the backhand net shot. First you point the racquet up towards the shot coming to the net on the backhand side, then pull it back and deliver the appropriate reply. This cycle of pointing, pulling back and hitting is your circle, which incidentally need not be a perfect round circle. A big swing is a big circle.
    There are five choices to play net shots and all of them require the same approach-approach the net with your dominant foot so as to improve your reach and to arrive at the shuttle better balanced to play your net shots, and to extend and put your racquet up when you go for a net shot, and lastly, circles, small or big as appropriate. But these are the fundamentals and although they enable you to choose one from among the 5 choices to play net shots, they are not true deception net shots
    To have deception in your net shots you must either vary your racquet swing, vary your court movements, or vary the angle of contact.
     

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