Nozomi Okuhara ( 奥原希望 )

Discussion in 'Japan Professional Players' started by chris-ccc, Sep 27, 2011.

  1. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Messages:
    51,457
    Likes Received:
    4,190
    Location:
    Citizen of The World
    Exactly, and I believe every player will have a time when they are (dead) tired and naturally takes a bit longer time than usual between points.

    Also reminds me of those who talk a lot about fast/slow shuttles or halls, as if they are not within BWF tournament requirements, and only affect certain players but not their opponents.
     
    LenaicM likes this.
  2. LenaicM

    LenaicM Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2018
    Messages:
    1,280
    Likes Received:
    1,035
    Location:
    Europe
    Totally. I doubt the BWF want to see players during a final dragging their feet on the court because of a time limit between rallies and just reducing the quality of the game because of that.

    When you do play badminton you know that after a long rally on the third set you do need more than 15 seconds to be ready for properly playing again. A time limit would just downgrade the quality of the matches and the sport generally.
     
  3. samkool

    samkool Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    1,675
    Occupation:
    too pre-occupied to work
    Location:
    the next world tour tournament
    but he also said he wouldn't have a problem adjusting to the rule.
    i know. it's laughable the number of breaks they get.
    attrition is a factor in every professional competitive sport. name a professional sport where being in better shape than your opponent is not a good thing?

    athletes will adapt. did athletes 50 years ago in futbol/football/basketball/etc. ever imagine the athletes in their sport would be as fast and fit today relative to their time? and these are sports where the equipment hasn't changed. the current superstar sets the trend, the next generation catches up, and its superstar pushes it further.
     
  4. samkool

    samkool Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    1,675
    Occupation:
    too pre-occupied to work
    Location:
    the next world tour tournament
    i don't think so. i think we're spoiled and some fans may be worried about a degradation. having seen older matches in person from yang yang/morten frost/li yong bo/park joo bong/han ai ping/susi susanti/sidek bros days i gotta tell you... it's a snooze fest relative to today. even 2004 athens & 2008 beijing wouldn't make me lift an eyebrow anymore.

    pre-2006 was a war of attrition more so than today. it was built into the side-out scoring system.
    rally scoring required the athletes to be more aggressive, and they became more fit to deal with it.
     
    #464 samkool, Nov 10, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
    LenaicM likes this.
  5. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Messages:
    51,457
    Likes Received:
    4,190
    Location:
    Citizen of The World
    Of course, fitness is critical in any physical sport, the more so for a highly demanding one like pro badminton, so too technical skills, not to mention other factors that may tilt the balance in favour of one where both contestants are in the same league.

    Personally, I'd much prefer badminton at the highest level be decided by, say, 60% skills, 40% fitness, not the other way round; otherwise, the beauty of the sport would be the poorer for it, the creativity, the artistry, the wizardry, the trick/disguised shots, the deception, the battle of wits, the mind games, the poetry in motion,the excitement and thrills,and so on and so forth;rather than seeing mainly two players mostly slugging it out, dragging their tired feet, and wearing each other out to see who runs out of gas first.
     
    LenaicM likes this.
  6. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Messages:
    51,457
    Likes Received:
    4,190
    Location:
    Citizen of The World
    And I hasten to add, players who pushed themselves hard while labouring under the toll of accumulated fatigue also tend to increase the risks of injury.
     
    #466 Justin L, Nov 10, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
    LenaicM likes this.
  7. LenaicM

    LenaicM Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2018
    Messages:
    1,280
    Likes Received:
    1,035
    Location:
    Europe
    That's interesting but how would it affect the lower tier tournaments and athletes out of the top 15.

    That would definitely keep the fittest players at the top of the ranking but how would it affect the rest of the scene? Wouldn't it favour a certain kind and style of play? Wouldn't it make it a bit boring?
     
  8. LenaicM

    LenaicM Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2018
    Messages:
    1,280
    Likes Received:
    1,035
    Location:
    Europe
    Good point.
     
  9. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    16,401
    Likes Received:
    2,001
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    Wait till after OG, then BWF will start to implement 5x11 scoring. There should be even more aggressive playing.

    Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk
     
  10. Desireless

    Desireless Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2016
    Messages:
    821
    Likes Received:
    362
    Location:
    Antarctica
    Has that been confirmed by BWF?
     
  11. samkool

    samkool Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    1,675
    Occupation:
    too pre-occupied to work
    Location:
    the next world tour tournament
    they are complimentary tenets of the sport that push and pull each other along. the player with the current skill advantage will dominate until a player with a fitness advantage neutralizes their skills, then the fitness advantaged player will dominate until the next super skilled comes along to overtake their fitness advantage, and so on and so on. (throw in speed as a complimentary tenet also)
    all of those will be lifted during the natural progression of the sport. think back to the 80's until now... you've seen it with your own eyes.
     
  12. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Messages:
    51,457
    Likes Received:
    4,190
    Location:
    Citizen of The World
    Correct, but that is not the same as war of attrition, or simply long, grueling matches where the two players just keep the shuttle in play as long as possible and try their best to avoid making simple mistakes until the opponent collapses (including longer than usual breaks from both sides).
     
  13. samkool

    samkool Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    1,675
    Occupation:
    too pre-occupied to work
    Location:
    the next world tour tournament
    they will also adapt. the successful ones break through while the current ones age out. it really doesn't matter what the rules are. the system perpetuates itself with the help of human nature.

    use md as an example... start with athens 2004 and see how the game has changed. pick the dominant pair and pick out the advantage they held over the competition, then who and what style came along and replaced them. you'll see the style of play evolve before your eyes. you'll see certain extraordinary players rise up and change the game for whatever reason every couple of years. the speed era, the smash era, the awesome defensive era, the flat game era, the twin tower era, the return of the smash era, the resurgence of defense, the sukamuljo era :p, and so on... a perpetual cycle that progresses the sport organically.
     
    #473 samkool, Nov 10, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
    LenaicM likes this.
  14. samkool

    samkool Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    1,675
    Occupation:
    too pre-occupied to work
    Location:
    the next world tour tournament
    was there ever a time in your life you thought badminton was boring?

    do you think a rule exists that might make it too difficult for anyone to be good at it? thereby making it terrible to watch?

    new players will always be coming up competing within those rules while your current faves age out. the game will be as good as ever.

    Peter Rasmussen of Denmark and China's Sun Jun held the world record for the longest match of 124 minutes in mens singles... and i bet you'd watch every second of it. :D
     
    #474 samkool, Nov 10, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
    LenaicM likes this.
  15. Justin L

    Justin L Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2011
    Messages:
    51,457
    Likes Received:
    4,190
    Location:
    Citizen of The World
    Mostly in the past during the 15-point on serve scoring system period and some in recent decades under the 21-point on rally system where the matches were reduced to long war of attrition and the quality obviously suffered, such as the Nozomi - Sindhu 2017 WC despite the occasion.

    I mean, just look at all the epic matches between Lin Dan and Lee CW, even Chen Long's major matches with LCW were great matchups - I daresay I can't recall a single tired-looking rally between them (discounting the LCW leg cramp incident i n the 2014 WC).

    Yes, BWF will have to keep tweaking the rules to make the matches more entertaining to watch in terms of quality based more on skills than physicality, at least 60-40 for me instead of two tired-looking players trying to outlast each other in stamina more often than not.
     
    LenaicM likes this.
  16. London_Player

    London_Player Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2007
    Messages:
    415
    Likes Received:
    50
    Occupation:
    admin
    Location:
    London
    For Nozomi she does not have a weapon to hurt her opponent, she is fast around the court, good retriever, and has good stamina but no hard smash or deception or higher technical skills. In the last game against Chen today, who won when she attacked but Nozomi was hoping or praying for unforced errors or tiring her opponent.

    I think for WS, BWF should consider changing the score to 11 points in the deciding game. The women don't have the same physical attributes as the men to have the same score system of 21 points in the final game. In the old system, women had fewer scores than men, taking into account their gender. It's obvious when we see WS going into deciding game, it's painful and disconcerting when you see players struggling and crouching on the floor to catch their breaths. It's not nice but a torture.
     
    #476 London_Player, Nov 10, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019
  17. minions

    minions Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2018
    Messages:
    2,938
    Likes Received:
    823
    Location:
    Indonesia
    She lost in final again. But, this time, it is a rubber game and the third game is a close one. She is definitely making a progress. I am sure that it won't be long for her to finally win a title.
     
    Pcyl likes this.
  18. trizzforce

    trizzforce Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2019
    Messages:
    706
    Likes Received:
    365
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Yeah. There was a brief phase in the middle of G3 when she made so many unforced errors and that was her undoing. She's not Kento Momota with the ability to recover (repeatedly) from 6-7 points deficits against various opponents.
    Especially true when playing against CYF; if it was against Intanon, I would say it's possible to recover that many points.
     
    Pcyl likes this.
  19. minions

    minions Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2018
    Messages:
    2,938
    Likes Received:
    823
    Location:
    Indonesia
    I think that to be able to beat CYF, she has to be error-free/error-less. But, that requires her to keep the intensity at all times. I don't doubt her retrieving skills. But, sometimes, the errors can show up.
     
    Pcyl likes this.
  20. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    23,818
    Likes Received:
    4,791
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    Cannot. Equal scores was decided by the Court for Arbitration of Sport.

    It happened after a spectacular own goal by BWF who had tried to reduce the points score of I think both women’s mixed Doubles games in a blatantly sexist manner. (Remember that around that time they tried for improve the appeal of the game by trying to enforce clothing rules on the women). In order to be fair, the women’s singles games was increased to same points score.....
     
    Dangho, LenaicM and Quentin11 like this.

Share This Page