definitely AE and WC are the most coveted titles and this year both were won by CF/HFH and that's exactly my point that they are the strongest MD team currently. as for how special a tournament is, some of the super series may not be as lucrative as AE or WC, but it does draws some of the top players and that's just what we want to see and gauge the head to head match up. also, unless you are a top draw or top players, you wouldn't be invited to the Super Series Masters Final would you?! but i do appreciate you guys for setting me straight on the level of tournements. i do learn a thing or two whenever i get on here.
For this.. ..it's hard to justify whether a top player is one who is invited to the SSMF simply based on the WR points (for the SSMF, only the top 8 ranked players/pairs are invited); we've sort of discussed abt BWF's current ranking system in other threads. So, suppose, say if LD just missed being ranked in the top 8 or is ranked #10, does that mean he's not a "top" player??.. For the tournament being considered a "major", it's more than that to be lucrative. For a start, it has to have some sort of prestige/history (not necessarily award $$$). Those are the individual "major" titles. For team events/titles, you've got the Sudirman Cup and Thomas & Uber Cups as "major" titles/events.
very true in every sense of your point. i understand how the point system works, much like in tennis and even in golf's FedEx cup.But if LD (or any player/team) is not ranked in the top 8 in any year that pretty much mean he/she/team hasn't played or won enough tournaments to be ranked that high. thus also proves my point as NOT being the strongest player/team for that particular year. as inaccurate as the point system maybe, but that's just how the system works. however the accumulation of the points may not necessarily reflect the exact placement of the ranking and that's where the head-to-head win/lose in the majors among all top players comes into play. case in point, LCW (KKK/BHT) may ranked number 1 because of he (them) plays in more smaller tournaments and wins to accumulate points but falters in the majors against other top players (team). that in my opinion does not make him (them) the strongest player (team) currently, and same argument applies to MD. LD may very well be at the top of his game or in man fans' mind that he is still a top player, but the fact of the matter is if he didn't win enough tournaments or beat other top players to be ranked in the top 8, then he is not the strongest player CURRENTLY. and that's exactly my point for this discussion.
^^Hmm..^^ ..you've pretty much exposed the flaw in the current BWF world ranking system, esp. in relation to determining who's the "real", "true", "top" players/pairs.. ..the above 2 statements kinda sound a bit contradictory.. - Head to head record is one way to determine whether a player/pair is a "true", "top" 8 player/pair. However, BWF doesn't use the head to head record to determine who are the "true", "top" 8 players/pairs or to qualify for the SSMF. - A pair or player doesn't have to have less wins to not qualify in the top 8. A player or pair could simply not participate in enough SS tourneys to qualify or to make up enough pts to be ranked in the top 8. Say LD missed the first 7 SS tourneys, but has played and won the last 3 tourneys, IMO, he is still a "top" player despite having participated in less tourneys and garnering less total pts. Anyway, more discussion on the current BWF ranking system in the thread below: http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75692
Agreed. It is simple. When we try to determine who's the strongest, we tend to come up with a greedy method on our mind: first, set up an incumbent who is supposed to be the top, and then, search for another team who deserves to replace the incumbent. That's the idea exactly behind the H2H method. We need actual fights between them to know it. It's hardly to know just by counting the number of titles. How many titles they got before can play a supplementary role to support the result. That's why the general ranking system doesn't give good gauge for our curiosity. Actually, we do not have sufficient data for a shorter time span, which is the problem we have. In tennis, the top players participate in most of the big tourneys so it is easy to see who's the strongest, but in badminton, they don't on account of injuries, training, etc. If the title winners never fought against each other, we can hardly determine who's the strongest. Can you know who will win: Rexy/Ricky vs. FHF/CY? Enjoy~
China Masters is definitely not a major title yet. I think currently the major SS tournaments are AE, China, HongKong, Japan. With AE much more prestigious than the rest three.
this is a very interesting topic indeed but also one that will never have a consensus to it. the only point that we all will agree on is to disagree. we all have a different idea or method in mind ready to debate and to defend our favorite team. whether is injuries, ranking, titles won (majors and SS) past and/or present or match up (head to head) records. even with all that still will not be enough to convince which team is better. i will admit i am definitely a die hard supporter for my team. for me, i look at my player/team on a year to year bases just like any other sports. btw, injuries is part of the sports. it is the war of attrition. if you are injured then you can't play thus can't possibly be the strongest team currently. of course with injury in mind, that player/team will be constantly changing from tournament to tournament as well. if all else is good, then the majors will my determining factor. having said that, CY/HFH is out of the running because they just pulled out of HK open due to injuries. haha now i'll leave this discussion because i just shot myself in the foot and there goes my team. :crying:
Again, (2009 HK SS) MK/HS failed to win a title in a tournament in which JJS/LYD participated. Enjoy~
either its the problem with the ts stats or the england pair defense is good, can retrieve every smashes from the koreans, or maybe mostly are the english pair mistakes..
It's simple lah.. ..Markis & Hendra are very afraid of meeting LYD & JJS (in the Semis), thus they lost tamely to Alvent & HendraAG..
Hendra Setiawan? It makes sense then. It was really unexpected. I hoped Kindra could have a chance to fight against the koreans.
oh ya?? can u read "STATISTICS" upside the SCORING GRAPH?? i think u were a profesor of statistic but even u dunno what statistics look like or maybe how to spell STATISTICS
LYD & JJS are at the brink of not being invited to SSM, hope they will do well in both HKO and China open.
