They have a place, even at the highest levels of play; but you need good judgement to spot the opportunity. The stronger your opponents are, the less likely it is that a punch clear will work. But even the strongest opponents sometimes get caught off-guard. You certainly don't want to get into the habit of playing punch clears frequently. But by all means experiment, and see whether you can surprise your opponents.
More likely, playing a punch clear will surprise your own PARTNER(who can not see what you are doing) more so than your opponent(who can see what you are doing), especially when the opponent sees it coming and punish it while your partner is still retreating to the proper defensive position.
As a general rule, never lift unless you have to. You're giving your opponents a massive advantage by putting them on the attack and if the people you're playing are any good, they will finish the point. Hitting an underarm sort of clear come lift thing isn't so bad grhm2356. There are worse things you can do, but there are also better things. If I'm put in to a position where the only shot to play is a lift, then obviously, I'll play a lift and put the opposing side's weakest played on it to minimise the damage. If I don't have to lift but I can't hit a smash or a decent clear to one of the corners, then I often try to play a slice drop or other similar netshot to one of the corners to move the front play and try to make him lift.
I think the best stroke to someone who knows what s/he is doing, the the stroke that s/he masters, and the most effiecent to put him/her into the winning situation, depend on the opponents and partner. I agree that keep lifting might not be the best stroke in genreal. However, in average club level of playing, the so-call "bang bang kids" (who has the raw power, but not very consistent in their own smash or slow recovery) usually tend to lose even faster. Partially due to unforced errors, partially due to wasting of energy. Personally, I think effectively mix up the strokes, will be 1 necessary element toward "crafy".
well, a lot of people think that they can still play a net shot with the shuttle halfway down the net, because they don't feel pressured (i.e. they're not full stretch and in desperate mode). problem is that most people they can play an accurate net shot when they're taking it halfway down the net. the truth is, unless your opponent is slow on the net, any shuttle that has traveled 6 inches below the net is too dangerous to try anything flash. my point was that sometimes, its better to lift than try play a shot, which, while not glaring wrong, will simply put you in an even more disadvantageous situation. scenario: someone drives towards your backhand corner when your partner serves to them. you take it slightly below net level (meaning any drive you do will have to go upwards and risk getting cutoff). now, in this case, you don't HAVE to lift. you can do a cross court drop, straight drop, cross court drive, or straight drive. because you have taken it below the net, any of these shots will travel upwards. meaning there's a large chance they get intercepted. if you instead, just lifted it to the back court, yes, you give the attack away, but that's probably better than playing a slightly loose drive and have your partner get it in the face.
At top level, and if my partner doesn't attack, but instead gives it away by supposingly surprise the opponent with a clear, only end up having a smash coming at me while I am in the front expecting to cut off any lose reply from the opponent, I will communicate with him by kicking his butt for real. If you try to surprise a top level "pair"(who by the way, can also communicate and cover for each other) with a "clear", it better be super fast... if it is a super fast clear, and the opponent manages to smash it(assuming a powerful smash), what makes you think communication eg. "screaming sides" at the last second can help??? Those tactics can only work on at most medium level players... otherwise you would have seen it done on a regular basis even in provinical/states tournaments... but seriously, how often do you see those clears at decent level of mens doubles?
yeah, if you're good enough to drive it back accurately, then by all means do it. all i'm saying is that there are times when lifting shouldn't be the last option in the book. perhaps i worded it incorrectly. in that scenario, then a drive would be ideal, but would you play a drop or lift? so basically, your option should be something like 1. drive 2. cross court drive 3. lift 4. drop i just don't like it how people keep emphasizing that you should only lift as a last resort, when in some cases, you can do much worse things. just saw your other reply, so won't bother making a new post. if you're at top level, i'd say you have to be pretty desperate to try a punch clear.
one thing when your talking about comminication of doubles i know at the high level you and your partner are in sync with whats happening cause remember your both moving according to where the shuttle is placed and there is no time in which one of you is standing still and although your partner might not be able to see if you hit a punch clear until it comes over his head and into his view that is still alot of time for him to move into a defensive position because regardless he was already ready to be moving for the shot based on what his partner would have played. back to the lifting for no reason, i havnt heard it stated yet but i know that sometimes in tournaments when players are playing they might be forgetting what to do might be uneasy or unconfident in their shots so they will try to go for a safer one in this case they might think they should lift the shuttle even when under no pressure instead of playing another shot. not saying it always happens and not always to high level players but some people are like that they can do stuff in practice and know the theorys as to why to hit a shot and what shot to hit at what time but in a tournament they might fall apart.
you would be surprised at what your opponent isnt expecting, they will return it but it would put them off balance, thats just like asking whats the point of hitting a jump drop then or anything like that. the offensive and defensive positions of a pair can easily change many times in a rally and if its a strategic clear and the player knows what hes doing then the pair can benifite from it greatly even at the international level. mental toughness deffinetly plays a part in who will take the match and the shots a player plays, but i was just saying that in terms of lifting the player could be getting nervous and that could the reason as to why there lifting it alot more than usual. now yes with everyone who is commenting on this form this is where it gets a bit ambigous about the whole "lifting when not necissary" to different players it will mean different things. to me and you it most likley means different things as well. but well just hope no fights are started over this.
First of all, I hope you don't find the "tone" of my post to be too aggressive, if so, I apologize. I only hope to engage in a well manner debate over this topic here. I guess the "when is it necessary to do a lift" has a lot to do with personality as well. For more conservative players, they may want to avoid taking risky shots and may choose to give up the attack easily, therefore prefer to defend rather than do what the more aggressive players may do, which is to take chances in order to gain the attack. However, one thing I can be confident to say is that there should be no reason to lift when receiving a short serve... does anyone disagree with this?
that i can agree on, the only time i can see a lift comming off a short serve is if you hesitate and leave it because you are not sure if its short or not and last minute see its going to land in then more than likley your going to lift it. but other than that if your ready to recieve the serve in doubles/mixed there should be no reason to just lift right off the serve there are many other options aviable; dump to the net, push back at the server, push at the servers partner, midcourt dump on players non racquet side, or push to the back on players non racquet side, etc.
I disagree with it. Sometimes you start to leave a serve that you think is falling short, only to realise at the last moment that it's going to touch the line. In this situation, you should play a high lift to a corner. I've seen this happen at the top level (albeit not often). There are no absolute rules. Epistemology 101: He knows much who knows he knows nothing. Back to lifting/clearing in general: I remember a rally where Gao Ling played a cross-court punch clear that left Antony Clark and Donna Kellog standing. It was expertly judged and certainly took me by surprise. Having said all that, I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment of "you lift, you lose". It's a good rule of thumb, and it's certainly essential to develop an attacking mindset if you want to succeed in doubles.
Right! a cross court punch clear that pass right thru the center of both players will be effective after they get used to your straight punch clear cross (i normally refer it as a shooting lob). Good point
Aha, such a fundamental statement! Best one I've seen for a long time. A lot of people will try to work an advantage when really, the situation doesn't allow you to play that sort of shot. What happens in the end is you yourself have a good chance of losing the point from trying too hard. Another reason for a lift is to change the rhythm/flow of the game. One of your own habits when lifting is that you lift to the same height and same angle. In short, your opponents get used to the type of shot you play over the course of a game. Play different lifts during the game - sometimes lower ones, sometimes higher ones, sometimes really high ones that go right to the backtramlines. These introduce variety into the game and breaks the opponents rhythm.
Most of us do the lift/clear because we are slower and/or too lazy to move faster . My comment: (1) Most players do an underarm clear/lift because we are not fast enough to get to the shuttlecock to do a netplay challenge with a spin/tumble shot. (2) Most players do an overhead clear because we are not fast enough, and/or too lazy to move faster than normal, to get into position do a downward shot, such as a dropshot or a smash. It's all in the time factor. My observation: (1) To execute a good tight net play, we must make contact with the shutlecock before it falls below 10 cm below the net height. That means we have to move very fast to it. (2) To execute a good overhead dropshot, we need to be around .25 seconds quicker (in our preparation) as compared to executing an overhead clear. (3) To execute a good smash, we need to be around .50 seconds quicker (in our preparation) as compared to executing an overhead clear. Most of us do the lift/clear because we are late. It could also be that we are too lazy to move any faster. Question: Why do we do the lifting/clearing? Answer: They are the easier shots to do in terms of the time required to prepare to do them. Question: Is lifting/clearing a good tactical play? Answer: Hitting downwards should have more advantages than hitting upwards. .
Lifting...sometimes can actually help you set up a shot that will win your rally. You can win by defending simply by counter-attacking their smash...or rush up the net when they do a poor smash or drop shot...also lifting allows time for you and your partner to rest for a split second extra just so you guys are back in position...
