Perfecting Deception

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by R20190, Sep 18, 2017.

  1. R20190

    R20190 Regular Member

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    Deception is such an important part of the modern game that I think it deserves a detailed look at the different techniques in much greater detail. We have dissected many techniques on this forum but haven’t really looked closely at what it takes to actually deceive your opponent. Deception is used at all levels and can win a lot of points or create a lot of opportunities yet it is often not given enough thought at amateur level.

    We have all seen the effects of deception and probably know the basics techniques that are used by watching the pros at work. It is a topic that has been discussed before but only generally on a superficial level and not sufficiently scrutinized and discussed in detail.

    What I am hoping to achieve this with a few detailed pointers on the techniques and mental notes that one can try and adopt as well as practice at their leisure in the absence of a coach.

    There are some players who just seem to be able to get it right such as Peter Gade, Lin Dan, Zhao Jianhua, Tai Tzu Ying etc but there are other top players who do not seem to be quite have that level of deception no matter how hard they try – Lee Yong Dae for example, is an extraordinary gifted player but no matter how hard he tries he just cannot deceive his opponents at will.

    So what is it that differentiates a good deceptive shot from one that isn’t? The obvious answer would be the one that works! But what I am referring to here is the detail in the technique. What are the subtle differences in the technique between the good deceptive shot and the bad one that doesn’t quite deceive? Is it about getting to the shuttle earlier? Is it the body language? Is it timing? Is it the way you hold the racquet? Or is it something else?

    There are varying degrees of deception, ones that completely leaves your opponent grounded and flummoxed to ones that sends them in the wrong direction and ones that simply delays them slightly but enough to open an opportunity in the rally.

    It is easy just to say “make your shot look like any other” and although that is the crux of it, I would like to break it down further and explore whether there are other less obvious things going on or perhaps other techniques that can be adopted to achieve the same result.

    I have listed below some of the main deceptive shots that are played and outline the way they are executed and the effect they have as a starting point. You may refer to the shots by different names or may have been taught to play them differently but hopefully you will know the shot I am talking about.

    I’m sure we all know somebody who is very good at some of these shots. If you are one of these people or have been taught to play them, it would be great to share with the rest of the forum as to how you play these shots, what mentally are you thinking as you play the shot, what are you aiming to do / focus on, how do you practice it? How did you learn it? What are your tips on achieving the perfect deceptive shot?

    1. The flick serve. This can result in either the receiver struggling to get behind the shuttle or going the wrong way (forward). Why is it that some players are able to flick serve so deceptively that it consistently causes the receiver to move in the opposite direction whereas others are read more easily? Obviously it is important that your flick serve “looks” like any other low backhand serve, but studying it in more detail what is it exactly that prevents others from reading it. Why are players like Kevin Sukamuljo so good at doing this? Is it the length of backswing? Is it the speed of the forward swing? Is it the timing? Or is it something else? What gives it away? What prevents it from being read?

    2. In-to-out forehand (or backhand) return of serve. This usually has the effect of either sending the receiver’s rear court player in the wrong direction, or very late to the shuttle. This is adopted in both singles and doubles but you see it most often in doubles. There are two variations to this, one that involves showing the racquet face in one direction and playing the shuttle in another direction at the very last moment. The other involves a double action.

    3. In-to-out backhand cross court net shot. Again, this is a shot that is used in both singles and doubles which shows you playing the net shot (or holding the racquet) in one direction initially, then playing an “in-to-out” BH cross net drop. This has the effect of making the opponent get to the shuttle late or completely grounded with no idea where the shuttle is going. At professional level, I noticed a slight difference to the way it is played in singles and doubles. For example Lin Dan and Momota play this shot quite well but there seems to be a lot less racquet movement than the same shot played in doubles. This could be due to the difference in position on court though.

    4. Deceptive punch clear. For me this is one of those shots that can be spectacular to watch, almost admirable even as the person being deceived when it is played to perfection. It’s almost illusion-like when played by someone who has completely mastered this shot. In all the many years I have played the sport, I have only come across two players who can play this absolutely perfectly, many others can do it well, but not what I call perfectly. I mean even to the point that top county players are fooled despite knowing it is coming. It is also one of the shots that I personally would love to master. The effect of this seemingly simple shot is that the returner is left stranded or delayed to the extent that the shuttle can sail well over their heads despite having plenty of time to prepare. The returner of the shot is generally expecting a smash or drop and doesn’t expect a clear. The best executions of this shot I have seen usually completely confuses the returner so much so that they only know it is a clear well after the shot has been played. And in some instances it is too late or they feel somewhat humiliated by the deception that they give up trying to retrieve it.

    5. Double action low forehand and backhand lift. When I think of this shot, I think of Peter Gade and Lin Dan. This shot is disguised as a cross court net drop/push initially then the actual shot is a lift (usually straight). PG does this extremely well and often fooled his opponents or delayed them significantly.

    6. Disguised drop shot. This shot comes in different forms. One that is often played in singles by players like LD and PG, the reverse slice, where the shuttle is brushed on one side making it look like it’s going one way but it actually goes in a different direction. Another is predominantly played in doubles, where the player shows them preparing to hit a smash but then slows down the racquet at the last moment to play a drop. JJS and YYS both play this fantastically well. But one of the masters of this shot imo is ZJH.

    7. Holding shots – forehand and backhand. This is played by many singles players but once again LD comes to mind as the master. He is able to hold the shuttle really late and still generate enough power to lift deep with a very small take-back.

    8. Peter Gade’s (FH/BH) cross net shot. This is a borderline trick-shot imo and has no right in competition yet PG has pulled it off in competition as clear winners. He would show a net drop shot preparation with the racquet high, but then lets the shuttle drop before hitting it with “underarm” shot played by turning his wrist to hit a cross court net drop. Nobody else has pulled this off in competition afaik.

    I’m sure there are many other deceptive shots that I have not included above. Feel free to add and discuss them.

    But I think it is important to separate the subtle difference between “trick shots” and deceptive shots. In so far as “trick shots” are perhaps intended to have an element of entertainment and are considered non-conventional shots that are generally not practiced in training whereas deceptive shots are intentional, with a purpose to create an opening in a rally and are practiced in training.
     
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  2. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    Will be looking forward to reading the discussion on this thread. I have not much to add as I cannot deceive anyone for all I try.

    However, I do want to add that the true masters of deception in the past couple of decade is Hendrawan and Gopichand. Gopi can deceive on the service alone.
     
  3. DarkHiatus

    DarkHiatus Regular Member

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    Intanon and LD have an excellent deception where on receiving a drop shot/net shot late, they start a deep lift action and somehow slow the racquet down before contacting the shuttle lightly, resulting in a straight hairpin net shot.

    They do it so well that often they can tumble the shuttle too, but the deception is so convincing that the receiver is often leaning back, ready to move to the rearcourt when the net shot comes, so they are left stranded.

    Often an outright winner, and if not, they turn a disadvantageous position completely round.

    Ridiculous amount of racquet control required to slow the racquet down sufficiently, but also to ensure the swing is fast enough to convince the opponent that you want to lift it. I've seen others do it, but they slow the racquet down early enough that it's no longer convincing.

    I'm currently trying to learn the various sliced drops as a deceptive variation from smashing. I have found that maintaining the smash stroke speed and varying the slice angle allows you to play different powered smashes with the same action (from drop landing on service line, to full out smash), which messes up the receivers defence timing. This seems to be better than simply playing a half smash without slice as the receiver can prepare defence earlier for a slower smash, even counterattacking.
     
    #3 DarkHiatus, Sep 18, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2017
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  4. MSeeley

    MSeeley Regular Member

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    You have a very good starting point. If the topic is "deception", then you should consider the qualities that make a player be classed as "deceptive", versus a shot being classed as "deceptive". And I agree whole heartedly with @kwun - gopichand is the most deceptive player I have ever seen.

    As an example: a stop drop (the one you referenced as played to look like a smash then resulting in a drop shot) is an actual deceptive shot. It is played in such a way that it is intended to deceive. A punch clear is a deceptive shot: it is played in such a way that it is deliberately deceptive as there is a noticeable "pause" before the shuttle is actually "punched" - Gopichand hit every clear as a punch clear. He was remarkably skillful. However, some players would be described as deceptive. A player who always plays a stop drop is not deceptive. A player who only occasionally uses the stop drop becomes very dangerous as you don't know what shot they will hit.

    So some deceptive shots are:
    Hold and flicked lifts played from the net
    Stop drops
    Severely sliced drops (would need to be played with a deceptive body movement as well)
    Punch clears
    double or triple action shots - usually played near the net, and involves showing one or two different shots before finally playing another shot (usually showing a net shot, a cross net shot, then a lift, or a net shot shown and a drive played etc).
    Deceptive shots often rely on exaggerated body movements, "fake" racket movements, or a deliberate "holding" of the racket just prior to hitting the shot.
    Note: holding the shuttle is an interesting skill - you are hoping to make the opponent move too early and guess where it will go, before you then play a different shot. No racket action was performed to deceive the opponent, but the opponent will be deceived nonetheless.

    What makes a player deceptive? Well, a player would really need to use a large variety of shots before you could call him deceptive. If every lift was done using a "deceptive" racket skill (e.g. hold and flick) then they are no longer deceptive. The most prominent skill they must have is the same racket preparation for several strokes, and they become even more deceptive the smaller their swing becomes. For example, in 2008, Lin Dan was the most deceptive player in the world because you couldn't ever tell whether he was going to smash, drop or clear from overhead, and you couldn't tell if he would hit straight or crosscourt, with or without slice etc. This is because the way he prepared for each stroke was identical, and the swing for each stroke was very small (a long swing allows your to see it coming in some cases). Of course, he was only successful because each of his shots, which in themselves were not deceptive shots, were a very very high quality. So you didn't know where he would hit, and he always played an extremely high quality shot, and he played many shots with great variety e.g. expecting a clear but he plays a dropshot instead. But he didn't play all that many ridiculously deceptive shots - it was just that the possibilities for his shots were so numerous. This made him a fantastic deceptive player, without using a huge number of deceptive shots.

    Obviously to be "deceptive", the execution of your shots needs to be immaculate - it really hinges on excellent ready positioning, that is consistent for all shots in that area of the court, with the appropriate racket skills to then execute a variety of deceptive or regular shots, and the tactical awareness to actually use those shots.

    Being deceptive can sometimes just mean making an unexpected choice e.g. a short lift comes up, and I jump and play an attacking clear (with no deception) cross court. The unexpected nature of my shot will make my opponents unsure of what shots I will play, making me deceptive. Obviously, my smash and my clear should appear to be the same in this situation for maximum effect, and I can be even more deceptive by using a punch clear.
     
    #4 MSeeley, Sep 18, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2017
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  5. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    While I cannot tell how to deceive as I am not good at it. I have in a couple of occasions been the recipient of some mastery deception.

    Once I was hitting with a former world champion from China. All I had to do was to receive her dropshots. Her preparation and shot execution was so consistent and the motion was so flawless that I was often sent to the wrong side of the court. There was not guessing, at least not from my skill level, at what she would do. There was no trick. All there was was exactly the same preparation, and very minute movement during execution. That was the time when I experienced the famous Chinese reverse slice.

    Another time I was playing against a former HK national player. I believe we were playing a game and both he and I ended up at the T. All he did was to do a netshot back and me and I was glued to the ground. He gave me no hints at what he was about to do, and the execution was simple but quick. I literally saw the shot land 3 feet from me and I couldn't move. Same as above, there wasn't much trick in either case. There was no double motion, it was very simple shot that didn't give away the outcome.
     
    #5 kwun, Sep 18, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2017
  6. ucantseeme

    ucantseeme Regular Member

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    IMO a good deception just work when you always have various options and use all of them. I know a player who have a good deceptive push. His body language and posture are decent, you can't tell to which side he pushs. I played alot against him and can tell that he always push to the same side/spot in the same situation. I can bet money on it and would win everytime. So his deception is good if he plays against unknown players, but we know each other well, so his deception became because of his usage and regular same selection nearly worthless.

    IMO a good deception should keep the opponent always guessing and you should always use different and randomly deception. An overuse will make it some day useless. Also the same pattern will make it nearly useless.

    Deceptive means to me as an opponent that I don't know what is coming and anticipate wrongly and deadly. As a player it simply means to me that I do everything the same to my opponent but create a different shot/direction. My opponent need to be ready for minimum 2 shots, better more and I should always use this amount randomly to keep him guessing. I experienced that my "deceptive" shots are most efficient against players which don't know me well. Against familiar players I need some more change to get same results and need to add some shots in the game for the same motion more often to keep them guessing. Less is more, the opponent should never guess the shot. So I use it rarely.
     
  7. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    Excellent thread.

    May I also add that a significant component of how well a deceptive shot works is how well it messes up the opponent's split step timing and rhythm, by varying and delaying the timing, speed and direction of your shot.

    When TTY is at her best, it's just wondrous to watch as her opponent's footwork and split step timing eventually go down the drain.



    Sent from my P027 using Tapatalk
     
    #7 visor, Sep 18, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2017
  8. R20190

    R20190 Regular Member

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    I have always believed that badminton is a bit of an art in as far as the way someone plays tends to display their personalities in real life. It allows people to express themselves through their style of play. So I guess you not being able to deceive is no bad thing! lol Some players don't need to use heavy deception at all to win - Chen Long is a good example and the way he plays tends to reflect his personality quite well.

    But hopefully as this thread develops, it will encourage you to give a few deceptive shots a try?

    Yes I agree Gopichand was a very deceptive player, but I'm not sure I would consider him the most deceptive. I think there are quite a few that could be worthy candidates, though each will have their different strengths.
     
  9. s_mair

    s_mair Regular Member

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    Very interesting thread. And although the clip has been posted before, I just feel it needs a place in here. You want deception perfection? Here you go:


    Speaking of "normal people's" game, I think that deception starts by focussing on having the same racket preparation and movements and still being able to do several shots from it. Another important factor (especially in singles) is to hit your shots with different timings - especially if your opponent hits a drop shot and you are there early for a return. A slightly longer holding phase can easily provoke the opponent to move too early and allowing you to target the opposite corner.

    A couple of years ago I was playing a singles match against a guy who was playing three (or four?) leagues above me. And he didn't need a single big smash to literally wipe the floor with me. All it took was for him to hold his shots long enough to make me move too early and then hit the shuttle in the opposite direction. On a psychological level, I think I have never felt worse on court than that. Ever watched a cat that plays around with a captured mouse? Yep, I got a glimpse of how the mouse must feel in that situation. :confused:

    Last year I took part in a training workshop that focused on trick and deceptive shots. It was surprisingly easy to do a lot of them if you get that shuttles fed properly and you can fully focus. To transfer them into you regular game and into an actual match is a totally different matter. I guess it needs many, many hours of practise until these special shots finally become part of your standard arsenal.
     
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  10. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    This !
     
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  11. Rob3rt

    Rob3rt Regular Member

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    Interesting thread. I wouldn't call myself a deceptive player yet, but I'm working on it and playing a lot of deceptive shots that look the same. It's the style of play I enjoy the most. That's why I love watching LD and TTY play. When I'm the recipient of deception (which doesn't happen too often, because there are not a lot of deceptive players in the clubs I play, unfortunately) I lose the point not because I move in the wrong direction but because I wait until the shot is made and then I'm too late, either losing the point right away or creating a big opportunity for my opponent.

    An interesting anecdote is a very young and skilled player at my club. He got and still gets a lot of proper coaching and has excellent technique. He uses deception in almost all of his shots. I've played him a few times in singles and I noticed something which surprised me. His deception didn't hurt me at all, maybe delaying my movement 2 out of 10 times and I couldn't figure out why. But after thinking about it, I think I know the reason. It's his timing. He has done each deceptive shot probably over 150 times during coaching sessions (which means his coach feeds him the shuttle and he does a split step, moves there and plays the deceptive shot). And during the game he is doing the same. He doesn't watch me or actually wait, he just moves to the shot and does the deception, whereas other players watch me or are naturally more gifted and execute the shot when it hurts the most. The point I'm trying to make is that I think one of the biggest parts of a good deception is the right timing. Sure, technique, several look alike shots and getting early to the shot are key, but timing is essential.
     
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  12. MSeeley

    MSeeley Regular Member

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    Agree - very good point for consideration when playing deceptive shots!
     
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  13. R20190

    R20190 Regular Member

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    Some really good examples but it would be good to explain in detail how were you taught to play them. Or perhaps how you develop it yourself?

    I'll make a start. Take the "in-to-out" BH cross court net shot.

    The way I learnt it was to picture the path of the racquet moving as if I was drawing a parallel line with the fall of the shuttle initially before moving across the path quickly and pushing the shuttle in the opposite direction. The key is to do this quickly. But noting that this is a little different in singles.

    Here's a quick sketch...

    [​IMG]
     
    #13 R20190, Sep 19, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2017
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  14. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    Technically, I think you have a few main aspects:
    • Creating racket head speed with a short action (especially for net lifts)
    • Hitting slower than expected (e.g. stop drop or slice)
    • Changing direction with slice
    • Using a double or triple action, and keeping it compact / quick
    • Presenting the racket on the "wrong" side of the shuttle
    • Presenting the racket facing the "wrong" direction
    • Changes of timing designed to upset your opponents' movement
    • In general, being able to hit multiple shots off similar preparations (i.e. not giving away too many clues)
    • Ability to do these things while still taking the shuttle early (not always required, but often useful)
    • In particular, good hand skills are important, especially around the net
    Tactically, you need an understanding of when a given deception might be useful, but also simply what it's intended to achieve. It also helps to think about patterns of play: what shots have you already established? Which shots can be effectively "paired" together to create deceptions? It's tempting to think, "I can play everything from exactly the same action", but this isn't realistic. Some shots go together better, and some of these can be player-specific.

    At a high level, this concept runs deep. For example, a player can hit a crosscourt reverse slice from a "lazy" round-the-head position. This "reaching round-the-head" setup often gives away the reverse slice. It's then possible to play a punch clear from the same initial action -- this is not a very natural way to play the punch clear, so the opponent is more likely to be surprised.

    Deception is one of the things that makes badminton great. :) Even beginners can rapidly learn deceptions such as "hold and flick" to a level where they can use them in games. Yet at the top level, there are layers and layers of subtle deceptions and tactics, together with amazing racket skills to make them work.
     
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  15. Borkya

    Borkya Regular Member

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    Yes to this! To be the best deception shot isn't the one where you look like you are about to do one thing and do another. It's when you set up your racket so you can do several shots based on your opponents reaction. My coach is amazing at this, as is a few guys at my club and I'm trying to learn it. I'm a bit too transparent with my thoughts though, and I haven't gotten the timing down just yet.

    Right now the only deception I can do regularly is looking like I am about to smash but I actually drop. Mentally I think "smash! smash!" but at the last second I don't. I think without that mental part my body language might give away my deception.
     
  16. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    @R20190
    You had a pretty comprehensive list of deceptive shots listed, but there's one more to add. I discovered this accidentally.

    It works when the shuttle flies straight at you about 1-2 ft overhead within easy reach. You appear to smash hard with a forehand action across your body, but at the very last moment, you turn your hand even more ahead of the shuttle to hit with the backhand side to the other side. Works a treat!
     
    #16 visor, Sep 19, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2017
  17. DarkHiatus

    DarkHiatus Regular Member

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    Is this different from Number 6.?

    It sounds like the reverse slice (crosscourt) which seems to be such a useful stroke that I don't think many singles pros play a crosscourt drop shot any other way normally.
     
  18. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    Nope, I'm showing a hit with the forehand racket face to one side but at the very last moment I supinate my hand more and hit with the backhand face to the other side.
     
  19. DarkHiatus

    DarkHiatus Regular Member

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    Ah instead of early pronation in the normal reverse slice. Never seen this before!
     
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  20. Rob3rt

    Rob3rt Regular Member

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    So like the first shot played after the serve in this video but in reverse?

     

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